St. Joseph's

[SixTwentySix]

It really doesn't matter how close schools are. Its always up to the kid where he wants to go. If your schools is good enough you shouldn't worry other school. Dayton and Xavier have always recruited against each other and it hasn't hurt either school. Xavier been good at taking kids out of dayton. And dayton don't really go after kids in cincy

It is entirely up to the kid to choose. But if he's faced between a scholarship with a Big East team and a scholarship with an A10 team, both of which are local schools and 8 miles down the street from each other, which one do you think he'll choose (academics aside)? Put both of those schools in the Big East and the decision becomes a lot harder.

And since every thread on these forums ends up about Dayton anyway... Imagine Dayton going to the Big Ten. You mean to tell me that wouldn't eventually hurt Ohio States recruiting and boost Daytons? If Dayton steals just a single recruit from Ohio State because they're now in a top conference, then OSU just lost out. Same goes for Nova.

[XU85]

You hear about school A blocking school B all the time. In fact, Dayton seems to be concerned Xavier and Butler may block them from the Big East.

Before UD fans pounce on me, I am not advocating Xavier and Butler block them, I am simply asking if any one knows if 1 school can block another school or does it take several schools to block a school.

[Edrick]

According to the DDN, their sources said Xavier would rather they distance from Dayton. And Butler wouldn't advocate for them or anything.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/co ... r_ud.html/

Given all that's up against them and Xavier's position, I can't imagine Dayton ever securing an invite.

[XU85]

According to the DDN, their sources said Xavier would rather they distance from Dayton. And Butler wouldn't advocate for them or anything.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/co ... r_ud.html/

Given all that's up against them and Xavier's position, I can't imagine Dayton ever securing an invite.

Sounds like damage control in case UD doesn't get invited?

If UD does get invited, does that mean Xavier did not block UD or could not block UD?

[DeltaV]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. As a Domer, I should start throwing stones at my own glass house. Notre Dame is serial offender number 1 in this regard, and I can offer no excuses or justifications for it. The bastion of "integrity" I call my alma mater is every bit as driven by money as any other school, and probably more so. At the end of the day, though, I dislike this trend where ever it takes place. And right now, Villanova, you are the focus of my ire. St. Joseph's should be in this league, and you need to stop being a prima donna. Loathe your rival, sure, but respect him as well and, above all, embrace the rivalry. I've always been a casual Villanova fan, but I'm really starting to dislike you ... which is frustrating because I have a grad school application in place at Nova as we speak. But go ahead and maintain your air of superiority and dismissiveness toward your crosstown brethren because, as any well versed Jesuit or Augustinian will tell you, pride goeth before the fall.

For starters, we have the Big 5 rivalry with St Joes. It isn't like we don't play them, or avoid them; we look forward to that game every year.

What has St. Joes done to deserve being in this league? Look at the 3 teams we have taken so far; Butler, Xavier, and Creighton. All three have been in multiple NCAA tournaments over the past decade, won games, made sweet 16's, etc. St. Joes doesn't belong in the same conversation as those three. Does St. Joes belong in the same conversation as St Louis, Dayton, and Richmond? St. Louis recent success and seeming dedication to their program seems to put them as a solid lock for #11 (that seems to be the general consensus) assuming we go more than 10. So now we're between Dayton, Richmond; does St. Joes belong in the conversation with them? Besides their undefeated season (over 10 years ago now, I believe), what have they done on the court to justify their inclusion?

This conference is not going to become the next Atlantic 10, with 16 plus members, and I honestly don't think that St Joes is of the same caliber as the other teams being considered. If we were considering Duquense (yeah, I'm sure I spelled it wrong) or Detroit just for those markets I could see your beef. But this conference is intentionally going to be an exclusive collection of the best non-FBS football schools in the area. St. Joes just isn't one of the top 12.

[GumbyDamnit!]

Why would a conference want a high concentration of threatening basketball programs leading to more heated rivalries and border wars? Because those will end up being marquee games that draw an audience?

And right now, Villanova, you are the focus of my ire. St. Joseph's should be in this league, and you need to stop being a prima donna. Loathe your rival, sure, but respect him as well and, above all, embrace the rivalry. I've always been a casual Villanova fan, but I'm really starting to dislike you ... which is frustrating because I have a grad school application in place at Nova as we speak. But go ahead and maintain your air of superiority and dismissiveness toward your crosstown brethren because, as any well versed Jesuit or Augustinian will tell you, pride goeth before the fall.

Hey ND, who really cares about your "ire?" You and your Holier than Thou Golden Domers can go jump in those ACC waters and never look back...Why should you even care? This isn't your conference anymore. Go play Florida State and VA Tech. They clearly have more in common with ND than G'town, DePaul, Nova, and Marq. What is that which binds you all? Obviously not religious affiliation or academics. It's money--you guys love that stuff. At least the rest of us stuck together. And that is what this is all about. You guys are reknown for jumping every time the almighty dollar presents it self without any regard whatsoever about other schools you profess to have alliances with. Talk about "maintaining an air of superiority and dismissiveness towards your bretheren." Honestly what a completely self-absorbed athletic program ND has become, and you seem to represent it well. Do what I say, not what I do, huh? Get lost.

Should Gtwn feel superior to GW, or Catholic U. in BB? Should St. John's feel superior to Fordham or St. Bonaventure? Xavier to Dayton? Butler to Richmond? Answer is they should because they are better programs. Villanova is a better program than St. Joe's, and lines have to be drawn somewhere. What has St. Joe's ever done to make them such a coveted program in your eyes? They have an arena that seats 4K that they can't even fill, and a program in shambles. One Elite 8 in the past 30 years and a Final 4 over 50 years ago. Is it just the RC thing? Why don't we just add La Salle, St. Bonaventure and Holy Cross while we're at it. All of them are just as similar as St. Joe's. LS has won more tourney games this year than St. Joe's has in the last 10 years. Give me a break.

What I think is going on here is that you are a Joey's Alum/fan and have nothing to do with ND. Why would a ND fan, who is heading to a new league themselves, be hanging around a Big East message board unless you have an agenda? Sorry, St. Joe's but you will have to do your best in the A-10. Really? Now you have my "ire" NDGrad.

[GumbyDamnit!]

You hear about school A blocking school B all the time. In fact, Dayton seems to be concerned Xavier and Butler may block them from the Big East.

Before UD fans pounce on me, I am not advocating Xavier and Butler block them, I am simply asking if any one knows if 1 school can block another school or does it take several schools to block a school.

I think we are thiking about this issue in the wrong context. It's not about "blocking" as much as it has to do with maintaining a strong brand, and supporting each other to be as successful as possible. That's critical. We all need to become the BB leader in our prospective markets. It helps with TV money and it helps with recruiting. Nova needs Butler, G'town, Xavier and Matrq to be successful, so when talking to recruits we can point to playing against other great national programs. We need each other to dominiate our recruiting areas, so we can get the best players and help make this league wildly successful. If George Mason was considered as the 11th or 13th or whatever school, and G'town wasn't crazy about sharing the same media spotlight, I would hope that my school would back Gtown. For a team that has helped build the league, they deserve the benefit of the doubt. I now see Xavier, Butler and Creighton as no different. They are one of us now and deserve our loyalty. Let's not look for ways to make things more challenging for each other. What makes most sense for the 10? It would be different if Dayton had the cred of a Gonzaga. But they're Dayton. Really is there that big of a difference between adding Dayton or adding Richmond? And Richmond is a new market.

[xu95]

It really doesn't matter how close schools are. Its always up to the kid where he wants to go. If your schools is good enough you shouldn't worry other school. Dayton and Xavier have always recruited against each other and it hasn't hurt either school. Xavier been good at taking kids out of dayton. And dayton don't really go after kids in cincy

It is entirely up to the kid to choose. But if he's faced between a scholarship with a Big East team and a scholarship with an A10 team, both of which are local schools and 8 miles down the street from each other, which one do you think he'll choose (academics aside)? Put both of those schools in the Big East and the decision becomes a lot harder.

And since every thread on these forums ends up about Dayton anyway... Imagine Dayton going to the Big Ten. You mean to tell me that wouldn't eventually hurt Ohio States recruiting and boost Daytons? If Dayton steals just a single recruit from Ohio State because they're now in a top conference, then OSU just lost out. Same goes for Nova.

If you have ever been to the A10 board, you would see everything becomes about Dayton as well.

Seriously though, I think it is funny that we have five pages about a school that has less than a 0% chance of getting an invite (St. Joes not Dayton)

[XU85]

Gumby:

I agree with the majority of your post. As I said above, I am not advocating blocking any school. The context of my question was informational in nature. If you click on the Dayton Daily News link above provided by Edrick, you see that Dayton is concerned Xavier may "hinder" then from receiving an invitation to the Big East. It sounds to me like advanced damage control if they do not receive an invitation.

[FriarFan]

You hear about school A blocking school B all the time. In fact, Dayton seems to be concerned Xavier and Butler may block them from the Big East.

Before UD fans pounce on me, I am not advocating Xavier and Butler block them, I am simply asking if any one knows if 1 school can block another school or does it take several schools to block a school.

This is complete fiction that appears on these board ('blocking")...no one team has veto power over a whole conference. The Big East will have bylaws in place and a process to add teams. The old Big East had to have 70% of the teams approve to add a school I believe. Xavier will have one vote, Georgetown will have one vote. NOW...what Xavier can do is lobby against Dayton (for example) and they have the ear and respect of their member schools. And like anything these are individual people making decisions (the AD's and Presidents) and can be persuaded. Rumor has it BC lobbied against UCONN in expansion in the ACC and helped to change peoples minds to take Pitt instead. But they did not "block" or "veto" them. So theoretically Xavier could do the same...but if 7 - 9 other schools really want Dayton, Xavier is SOL.