ESPN's Katz says Creighton a "wise choice"

[Bluejay]

When I read above about Richmond and VCU fans bickering about 5,000-7,000 people in attendance, it really puts it all into perspective. Creighton's attendance is 2 to 3 times higher than those schools! I also think the comments stating that "if we played Georgetown and other big east schools, our numbers would be better" are a bit pathetic. That only means that people are coming out to see your opponents, not you! The novelty of seeing a new team will wear off after they come to your yard a few times. Richmond and VCU are currently in the A10 and people still aren't coming out regularly to see them in large numbers.

Whoa...you forgot to do your research on this one before you posted.

Yes, VCU is averaging "only" 7,963 fans per game (that's more than Butler BTW)...but that's because THERE ARE NO MORE SEATS TO SELL. VCU has sold out their last 31 home games, and that's a streak that predates their Final 4 run. VCU also has a season-ticket wait list, so there's a long line of people who WANT to see VCU...but CAN'T.

Also...an article you might enjoy reading: http://www.vcuramnation.com/2013/02/ram ... t-as-well/

To paraphrase, VCU has sold 69% more tickets to their away games in the A-10 than those teams are averaging on the season. That's a LEGIT bump for those teams... and it's also No.1 in the Atlantic 10 right now (although to be fair, Butler has played in front of pretty much all sellouts against good teams who have packed their venues most of the year, so they'd probably be tops if they had played VCU schedule). Moral of the story however is that you are COMPLETELY wrong, not only do VCU fans want to see VCU, but so do fans of other teams, and the numbers are there to prove it.

I'm completely right as the 7,900 fans for VCU are still less than half of Creighton's average game attendance. Yes, half!

I'd also suggest that if you want to look at impact among conference opponents, look at the difference between an MVC school's average attendance and the attendance when Creighton comes to town. Plus, Creighton doesn't benefit from people curious about seeing the new guy in the conference for the first time, which certainly explains at least part of any bump VCU causes on the road.

[thegalen]

When I read above about Richmond and VCU fans bickering about 5,000-7,000 people in attendance, it really puts it all into perspective. Creighton's attendance is 2 to 3 times higher than those schools! I also think the comments stating that "if we played Georgetown and other big east schools, our numbers would be better" are a bit pathetic. That only means that people are coming out to see your opponents, not you! The novelty of seeing a new team will wear off after they come to your yard a few times. Richmond and VCU are currently in the A10 and people still aren't coming out regularly to see them in large numbers.

Whoa...you forgot to do your research on this one before you posted.

Yes, VCU is averaging "only" 7,963 fans per game (that's more than Butler BTW)...but that's because THERE ARE NO MORE SEATS TO SELL. VCU has sold out their last 31 home games, and that's a streak that predates their Final 4 run. VCU also has a season-ticket wait list, so there's a long line of people who WANT to see VCU...but CAN'T.

Also...an article you might enjoy reading: http://www.vcuramnation.com/2013/02/ram ... t-as-well/

To paraphrase, VCU has sold 69% more tickets to their away games in the A-10 than those teams are averaging on the season. That's a LEGIT bump for those teams... and it's also No.1 in the Atlantic 10 right now (although to be fair, Butler has played in front of pretty much all sellouts against good teams who have packed their venues most of the year, so they'd probably be tops if they had played VCU schedule). Moral of the story however is that you are COMPLETELY wrong, not only do VCU fans want to see VCU, but so do fans of other teams, and the numbers are there to prove it.

I'm completely right as the 7,900 fans for VCU are still less than half of Creighton's average game attendance. Yes, half!

I'd also suggest that if you want to look at impact among conference opponents, look at the difference between an MVC school's average attendance and the attendance when Creighton comes to town. Plus, Creighton doesn't benefit from people curious about seeing the new guy in the conference for the first time, which certainly explains at least part of any bump VCU causes on the road.

Yes, you're completely right that Creighton uses the low-margin Amazon.com model to fill its rented arena in part via $6 Valpak coupons, BOGOs, and $200 no-donation-required season tickets. If I'm a family of four in Omaha I can go the movies for $40 or I can go watch a Jays game for $24. Guess which one I'm chosing? Be proud of what you've been able to accomplish, but try to maintain just an ounce of perspective.

http://www.groupon.com/deals/gl-creight ... source=rvs

http://www.valpak.com/coupons/printable ... leti/23647

[Natty]

I'm completely right as the 7,900 fans for VCU are still less than half of Creighton's average game attendance. Yes, half!

I'd also suggest that if you want to look at impact among conference opponents, look at the difference between an MVC school's average attendance and the attendance when Creighton comes to town. Plus, Creighton doesn't benefit from people curious about seeing the new guy in the conference for the first time, which certainly explains at least part of any bump VCU causes on the road.

Couple of thoughts...

1) I get that you're passionate about Creighton, they have a great home fan base, great program, etc etc, but you were still completely wrong in your post when you implied VCU needed a Georgetown to come to town to get people to show up. VCU has sold out there last 31 consecutive games, and that includes games against the likes of Stetson, Longwood, Florida Gulf Coast, etc. Richmond might need marquee opponents to get excited about a game, but to say VCU needs that is garbage.

2) You mention the curiosity of being "the new guy", but do you HONESTLY think if the A-10 had added even a George Mason (solid program, recent Final 4), opposing fans would be as interested? This year my Rams played a ton of teams that were new to me, but I can tell you right now I've got a lot more interest in our games against ODU and Richmond, two team's we've been playing for years. I think outside of rivalries, people aren't interested in "the new guy" as much as BIG GAMES. Which is something I think you need to consider with Creighton. You think people get up for Creighton just because they are Creighton...or because they were ranked most of this season with a Player of the Year candidate on their team? For example: Creighton at Illinois State this season had 8,813 fans in attendance, whereas two years ago the same game had 6,158. There are a NUMBER of factors that go into attendance, but I'd say "being the new guy" is waaaaay down toward the bottom of the list.

3) Somewhat related to my previous point, just because one has a larger home attendance, doesn't mean other people are dying to watch that team play. For example, Dayton leads the Atlantic 10 in attendance, but drew just 2,012 fans in a road game at La Salle. That's about 20% less fans than La Salle has averaged at home throughout the season. Now if Dayton was a ranked team do I think that number would look different? Of course.

4) Here are some other attendance averages: Duke = 9314, Butler = 7682, Notre Dame = 8110, Villanova = 7820, Georgetown = 9983, UCLA = 9303. Creighton averages just about double what all of those teams are pulling in. Do you laugh at their home attendance numbers and say they are having problems bringing in fans as well?

[Eight Legger]

Hey we get it, VCU can sell out. Congrats. Frankly, though I began with a comparison of UR and Creighton, I'm much more impressed with what Creighton is doing to fill an 18k arena with a student population less than half that vs. what VCU is doing to fill a 7,500-seat arena with 32,000 students and 50,000 alumni in town. The bigger question is: Why did VCU build a brand new arena a decade ago and decide that it should only seat 7,500? UR's arena is more than three times the size of its student population, and we still almost sold it out the last four games. So when VCU expands its arena to 95,000 and sells it out repeatedly, then come talk to me.

[Bluejay]

Do you laugh at their home attendance numbers and say they are having problems bringing in fans as well?

Who's laughing at anything? All I have said is that Creighton has tremendous attendance and travels really well. CU has had around 13,000 season ticket holders and top 10 attendance for quite a while now. I then pointed out how Creighton brings a ton of people to the conference tourney yearly (this year, that figure is worth over $500K to the conference). Those things are facts; and are almost certainly why Katz made the comment about our fanbase that he did in the column cited in the thread title.

From there your insecurity took over and this turned into you arguing that VCU's attendance is actually somehow better than VCU's attendance numbers show.

[Bluejay]

Hey we get it, VCU can sell out. Congrats. Frankly, though I began with a comparison of UR and Creighton, I'm much more impressed with what Creighton is doing to fill an 18k arena with a student population less than half that vs. what VCU is doing to fill a 7,500-seat arena with 32,000 students and 50,000 alumni in town. The bigger question is: Why did VCU build a brand new arena a decade ago and decide that it should only seat 7,500? UR's arena is more than three times the size of its student population, and we still almost sold it out the last four games. So when VCU expands its arena to 95,000 and sells it out repeatedly, then come talk to me.

I'm with ya on this one eight-legger. Big attendance by smaller schools (where even if 100% of the student body went to a game, the place wouldn't sell out) is much more impressive than schools where if only 25% of the student body went to the game, it would be a sell out.

[Natty]

From there your insecurity took over and this turned into you arguing that VCU's attendance is actually somehow better than VCU's attendance numbers show.

If you remember correctly (or just look back a couple of posts), my response was to you saying this:

"I also think the comments stating that "if we played Georgetown and other big east schools, our numbers would be better" are a bit pathetic. That only means that people are coming out to see your opponents, not you! The novelty of seeing a new team will wear off after they come to your yard a few times. Richmond and VCU are currently in the A10 and people still aren't coming out regularly to see them in large numbers.

...which was a pretty uneducated thing to say.

So if me countering with facts and figures (like a 31 game sellout streak or a +69% attendance increase when we travel to opposing A-10 teams gyms) comes off as insecurity to you, then that's on you.

You don't see me on here making baseless claims about Creighton's attendance or fan support.

[Bluejay]

From there your insecurity took over and this turned into you arguing that VCU's attendance is actually somehow better than VCU's attendance numbers show.

If you remember correctly (or just look back a couple of posts), my response was to you saying this:

"I also think the comments stating that "if we played Georgetown and other big east schools, our numbers would be better" are a bit pathetic. That only means that people are coming out to see your opponents, not you! The novelty of seeing a new team will wear off after they come to your yard a few times. Richmond and VCU are currently in the A10 and people still aren't coming out regularly to see them in large numbers.

...which was a pretty uneducated thing to say.

So if me countering with facts and figures (like a 31 game sellout streak or a +69% attendance increase when we travel to opposing A-10 teams gyms) comes off as insecurity to you, then that's on you.

I stand by my statement. To me, regular attendance of under 8,000 does not constitute people coming out to see VCU in large numbers, especially when you have 35,000 undergrads.