Conference Realignment: What Next?

[strikenowhere]

Hey guys,

Zag fan here from the Zag boards located at http://guboards.spokesmanreview.com/index.php. I figured I would add some perspective from a pro re-alignment fan! As it stands right now, the loss of BYU to the Big 12 hurts big time. We all knew going into BYU joining that they were only there until a Power 5 conference gave them an invite but many assumed it would never come, especially after the last round of realignment occured and they were left hanging. BYU games could be counted on as at least 2 or 3 Q1/2 games each season, which is obviously good for NCAA qualification/seeding. They have been relatively good at making the tournament, helping to accrue NCAA payout units for the league.
Additionally, BYU was/is a great foil to play against, as their fanbase is incredibly smug and are known as serial call complainers The fact that their teams are normally good, though, makes it a great watch, especially when beating them. I know there are some Zag fans who say good riddance, but honestly they are being incredibly short-sighted.

A lot of our fanbase wants to expand the WCC to replace the Cougs, but honestly the options are terrible. The leading candidates for invites are Seattle U, Grand Canyon, Denver U, and Cal Baptist.......yep. None of these schools can even come close to replacing BYU and all would drag the conference down varying degrees. This is basically where us pro re-alignment folks think it is time Gonzaga jumps ship. Now, the problem is where the hell do the Zags go?

The Pac-12 would be the most natural fit logistically, but the P12 are a bunch of state secular research institutions, while Gonzaga is most definitely not. Couple this with the fact that Gonzaga has no football program and the P12 said no to expansion it is a moot point.

The Mountain West would be another ideal fit logistically, but the quality of the teams are only slightly above WCC levels. Additionally the conference is a football conference and if we have learned anything over the last few years it is that football rules everything. The fear here would be that when the next round of conference realignment occurs, teams from the MWC would potentially get poached, leading to more instability.

The Big-12 would be a harder fit due to travel, but if the Zags were somehow able to join as a non-football member it could potentially work. The Big 12 would probably need to add another non-football school for balance. I would have suggested Wichita St., but as long as Kansas is in the conference that will never happen.

The final option would be the Big East. Besides the fact that I'm biased since I live in Jersey and would be able to see the Zags play every year on the east coast, I honestly think it is the best fit. The Big East, by its nature as a non-football conference, provides a degree of stability that is lacking elsewhere because of football realignment. The University slots right in as a fellow private religious school. The only issue, and of course it is by far the biggest, is the travel distance. The way I see it though is that Gonzaga would have to shoulder far more of the travel burden than any individual Big East team would. If we were to assume the Zags join and the league goes to 12, than you are looking at most at 11 trips to Spokane by the various Big East teams. Gonzaga themselves would have to travel 11 times for away games (although scheduling to pair close schools like UConn/Providence or St. Johns/Seton Hall could help alleviate somewhat). Now I am obviously not privy to travel budgets for any of these schools, but I have to think it would be doable.

Of course this is only for the Men's teams. If the Zags joined, the women's team & rest of the sports would have to be factored in as well so it is still a major, major issue monetarily. Some of my fellow fans have proposed having some sort of westward expansion of the BE to poach a couple of the teams from the WCC and MWC and to split into east-west divisions, but this honestly to me doesn't make any sense for the Big East to do because what value would any of the other teams add? I can't possibly see adding St. Marys, San Fransisco, and some MWC schools like San Diego St. as even remotely feasible or aligning with the Big East's collegiate makeup.

So that is just my opinion - thanks for reading!

[adoraz]

Gonzaga does not need the Big East. They can compete for national championships in the WCC. I just see no realistic scenario where any AD or President believes by sending its Pacific Northwest athletic department’s Olympic sports to the East Coast is viewed as a good idea. And before it gets recommended, you cannot join a conference for basketball only. Could a scheduling alliance be arranged? Absolutely. But that’s about as far as a Big East/Gonzaga marriage could go.

It's not just about being able to compete for national championships (which could be less likely now with BYU leaving), it's more that they're being severely underpaid. I get that travelling for all sports will increase their expenses, but I think it'd be more than offset by the increase in TV revenue, Tournament credits, ticket sales, etc. Plus, by joining a major league they'd improve their longevity after Few leaves.

I'm pretty sure the only reason they aren't in is because the Big East presidents haven't invited them yet. That could change with the TV negotiations. We're now at a disadvantage by having the fewest teams of any Power conference, and Gonzaga joining would put any questions about the strength of our league to bed.

Let's say if Fox offers an additional $12 million per year for Gonzaga ($1 million per school) on top of what they would pay a St. Louis or VCU. No idea if the actual number would be higher or lower. Then assume Gonzaga brings in more Tournament credits for each member. Would the Big East schools really be paying > $1 million+ per year for ~10 trips to Washington? And don't most teams travel far for some OOC games? Just replace a far OOC game with Gonzaga. If Creighton, a team that hadn't even made it to the S16 wasn't a problem, I don't get how Gonzaga is. Gonzaga is a stronger brand now than they were during realignment.

[kayako]

Could a scheduling alliance be arranged? Absolutely.

I keep seeing this and I fail to see how this is even desired. If the top BE teams wanted to play Gonzaga, why not simply schedule them? Nova's certainly not risking a trip to Moraga so another BE team can host Gonzaga. And Gonzaga probably feels similarly?

[strikenowhere]

Gonzaga does not need the Big East. They can compete for national championships in the WCC. I just see no realistic scenario where any AD or President believes by sending its Pacific Northwest athletic department’s Olympic sports to the East Coast is viewed as a good idea. And before it gets recommended, you cannot join a conference for basketball only. Could a scheduling alliance be arranged? Absolutely. But that’s about as far as a Big East/Gonzaga marriage could go.

Hi visiting Zag fan here from the Zags message board - you are correct that they have been able to compete for NCs so far in the WCC. The problem going forward here though is the loss of 2-3 Q1/2 games from the season, which directly impacts the tournament resume. Additionally there is certainly some nugget of truth to the idea that the Zags play cupcakes during their conference schedule and the loss of BYU only exacerbates this. BYU's Marriot Center holds 40k seats and it was always sold out for games against Gonzaga. It is certainly the most hostile territory the Zags face in the conference and having a game there in February certainly helped keep the team on its toes. As for the Olympic sports issue I view it as mainly a Gonzaga-centric problem that the rest of the Big East would only need to worry about once a year. If coming into the conference is lucrative enough for Gonzaga & the Big East to at least offset the additional travel costs I think it makes perfect sense to do so. In addition with the expansions of the major conferences there leaves fewer OOC games available for the Zags to pursue against quality teams.

The WCC is on the decline and there are no quality teams available to take the place of BYU. Sure St. Mary's has good years, but they have only made the tournament 7 times since 2000. Back in 2018 when the Zags flirted with the MWC the WCC made concessions regarding tournament shares, the conference schedule (to lose two games against the two worst teams from the previous season), and to push the rest of the WCC to upgrade their facilities and programs. It certainly doesn't seem to have panned out yet as it has still been #1 Zags followed by BYU/St. Marys in the #2/#3 spots in either order. Many years it has been a single bid league, even a couple with BYU in the fold. Gonzaga has simply outgrown the WCC and the main concern is that conference re-alignment has the potential to leave the Zags withering on the vine. They need to get out.

[adoraz]

Could a scheduling alliance be arranged? Absolutely.

I keep seeing this and I fail to see how this is even desired. If the top BE teams wanted to play Gonzaga, why not simply schedule them? Nova's certainly not risking a trip to Moraga so another BE team can host Gonzaga. And Gonzaga probably feels similarly?

I agree, I don't see the advantage of doing this. Let's say for example if we schedule 6 games with them and go 1-5 or 0-6 (very possible). How does that benefit us? That just makes the Big East look bad as we'd get zero credit for Gonzaga beating us. If Gonzaga then goes on to the Final 4 we'd get zero credit (literally... zero Tournament credits). Sure, we'd be adding a few extra high profile games for TV inventory, but it has potential to do more harm than good for the league IMO.

[Omaha1]

Welcome Zags fan.

I say add the Zags. No one else.

Done.

[GoldenWarrior11]

Gonzaga does not need the Big East. They can compete for national championships in the WCC. I just see no realistic scenario where any AD or President believes by sending its Pacific Northwest athletic department’s Olympic sports to the East Coast is viewed as a good idea. And before it gets recommended, you cannot join a conference for basketball only. Could a scheduling alliance be arranged? Absolutely. But that’s about as far as a Big East/Gonzaga marriage could go.

It's not just about being able to compete for national championships (which could be less likely now with BYU leaving), it's more that they're being severely underpaid. I get that travelling for all sports will increase their expenses, but I think it'd be more than offset by the increase in TV revenue, Tournament credits, ticket sales, etc. Plus, by joining a major league they'd improve their longevity after Few leaves.

I'm pretty sure the only reason they aren't in is because the Big East presidents haven't invited them yet. That could change with the TV negotiations. We're now at a disadvantage by having the fewest teams of any Power conference, and Gonzaga joining would put any questions about the strength of our league to bed.

Let's say if Fox offers an additional $12 million per year for Gonzaga ($1 million per school) on top of what they would pay a St. Louis or VCU. No idea if the actual number would be higher or lower. Then assume Gonzaga brings in more Tournament credits for each member. Would the Big East schools really be paying > $1 million+ per year for ~10 trips to Washington? And don't most teams travel far for some OOC games? Just replace a far OOC game with Gonzaga. If Creighton, a team that hadn't even made it to the S16 wasn't a problem, I don't get how Gonzaga is. Gonzaga is a stronger brand now than they were during realignment.

Gonzaga has a sweetheart deal with the WCC. They pushed for a 16-game conference schedule; they got it. If they wanted, they could get a sweetheart deal with the MWC. BYU not not affect Gonzaga competing for national championships. Regarding travel, respectfully, you’re thinking like a fan, not as an administrator or president. All non-men’s basketball sports for Gonzaga would be severely negatively impacted. It is an eight-hour flight one way. Realistically, how could Gonzaga justify sending its volleyball, soccer, baseball, golf, cross country and track teams to the East Coast with such frequency? They can’t (and won’t). No university president will sign off on that. Sorry.

Regarding a scheduling alliance - the WCC just lost BYU. Gonzaga just lost two key conference games. To counter the reality that a Seattle or Cal Baptist is likely to join the WCC, Gonzaga needs to beef up its non-con to maintain its resume. What is much easier, and much more realistic, is an alliance with the Big East by scheduling a home and an away annually with two BE members. This obviously helps Gonzaga replace BYU’s strength on the schedule. For the Big East, it is another huge power scheduling alliance (B1G, Big 12), that continues to enforce we remain a power conference. More importantly, and to the powers at Fox, they don’t need to pay more for adding a 12th member, which I’m sure the BE presidents are likely against (especifically if none add value like UConn did).

I cannot stress enough - Gonzaga will never be a member in the Big East, unless there’s a western pod to balance it out.

[GoldenWarrior11]

Gonzaga does not need the Big East. They can compete for national championships in the WCC. I just see no realistic scenario where any AD or President believes by sending its Pacific Northwest athletic department’s Olympic sports to the East Coast is viewed as a good idea. And before it gets recommended, you cannot join a conference for basketball only. Could a scheduling alliance be arranged? Absolutely. But that’s about as far as a Big East/Gonzaga marriage could go.

It's not just about being able to compete for national championships (which could be less likely now with BYU leaving), it's more that they're being severely underpaid. I get that travelling for all sports will increase their expenses, but I think it'd be more than offset by the increase in TV revenue, Tournament credits, ticket sales, etc. Plus, by joining a major league they'd improve their longevity after Few leaves.

I'm pretty sure the only reason they aren't in is because the Big East presidents haven't invited them yet. That could change with the TV negotiations. We're now at a disadvantage by having the fewest teams of any Power conference, and Gonzaga joining would put any questions about the strength of our league to bed.

Let's say if Fox offers an additional $12 million per year for Gonzaga ($1 million per school) on top of what they would pay a St. Louis or VCU. No idea if the actual number would be higher or lower. Then assume Gonzaga brings in more Tournament credits for each member. Would the Big East schools really be paying > $1 million+ per year for ~10 trips to Washington? And don't most teams travel far for some OOC games? Just replace a far OOC game with Gonzaga. If Creighton, a team that hadn't even made it to the S16 wasn't a problem, I don't get how Gonzaga is. Gonzaga is a stronger brand now than they were during realignment.

Gonzaga has a sweetheart deal with the WCC. They pushed for a 16-game conference schedule; they got it. If they wanted, they could get a sweetheart deal with the MWC. BYU does not affect Gonzaga competing for national championships. Regarding travel, respectfully, you’re thinking like a fan, not as an administrator or president. All non-men’s basketball sports for Gonzaga would be severely and negatively impacted. It is an eight-hour flight one way. Realistically, how could Gonzaga justify sending its volleyball, soccer, baseball, golf, cross country and track teams to the East Coast with such frequency? They can’t (and won’t). No university president will sign off on that. Sorry.

Regarding a scheduling alliance - the WCC just lost BYU. Gonzaga just lost two key conference games. To counter the reality that a Seattle or Cal Baptist is likely to join the WCC, Gonzaga needs to beef up its non-con to maintain its resume. They control that. What is much easier, and much more realistic, is an alliance with the Big East by scheduling a home and an away annually with two BE members. This obviously helps Gonzaga replace BYU’s strength on the schedule. For the Big East, it is another huge power scheduling alliance (B1G, Big 12), that continues to enforce we remain a power conference. More importantly, and to the powers at Fox, they don’t need to pay more for adding a 12th member, which I’m sure the BE presidents are likely against (especifically if none add value like UConn did).

I cannot stress enough - Gonzaga will never be a member in the Big East, unless there’s a western pod to balance it out.

[stever20]

gee, has anything happened recently??? lol.

Will be really interesting to see the impact of the Big 12 moves on the Big East. Big East now will be the only major league playing round robin as is right now. Will that continue?

For the AAC, going to be interesting to see how they go here. Have Memphis and Temple so a decent place to start obviously. Wichita too for basketball. Will be interesting to see if they can remain the top non top 6 conference....

WCC is impacted big as well with losing BYU. Makes it Gonzaga and St Mary's and then.....

[DudeAnon]

The Big East's identity is the home for basketball only power programs. Half of our conference is in the Mid-west as it is so its not like geography is the strand tying us together.

Could we add Gonzaga as a basketball only member?