Rank the 12 schools in value to the new league

[yorost]

I don't take much stock in coaches putting roots down. They have the money to live well, why shouldn't they? You bring in a program, not a coach.

Williams mentioned two schools himself in that article, Xavier and Butler.

The writer took the liberty of listing the other schools mentioned.

In recent weeks, universities such as Gonzaga, Dayton, Virginia Commonwealth and St. Louis have been reported as good fits for the Catholic Seven’s specifications. Additionally, Williams mentioned Xavier and Butler by name as particularly logical potential members.

Damned funny how we have become totally used to modern journalism wherein writers/commentators/anchormen "make" the news instead of reporting the news. And we lap it up like puppy dogs.

It might be a slip up, and the writer didn't indicate it was a complete list. "Such as..." leaves it open. It's a school paper, I'd go easy on it.

All I can say is that when I was at Marquette, Creighton seemed like a very well known, and respected, school. Then again, I had numerous friends from Omaha at Marquette, so I could have a skewed perception.

[thegalen]

Williams mentioned two schools himself in that article, Xavier and Butler.

The writer took the liberty of listing the other schools mentioned.

In recent weeks, universities such as Gonzaga, Dayton, Virginia Commonwealth and St. Louis have been reported as good fits for the Catholic Seven’s specifications. Additionally, Williams mentioned Xavier and Butler by name as particularly logical potential members.

Damned funny how we have become totally used to modern journalism wherein writers/commentators/anchormen "make" the news instead of reporting the news. And we lap it up like puppy dogs.

ljay- very true. It's also unclear whether he, the author, is inserting the bit about public schools, or taking the direct Williams' quote that follows and extrapolating or working backwards:

He also did not rule out the possibility of including non-Catholic and public schools (such as Butler), as long as their athletic programs fit the bill.

“I don’t think religious affiliation, historic or current, will be determinative of someone’s fit in the conference,” Williams said. “One need not be religiously affiliated to be committed to excellence.”

That said, Williams has only name dropped three schools ever in any talk of a new league: X, Butler, and VCU. I just cannot imagine a 5-7 East/West split. It makes no sense. The reality is that the Big East lost the East, and there isn't a better non-football playing candidate to be poached than VCU. In rebuilding the Big East basketball tradition and brand, it's just a no-brainer to take the Rams. Especially with a team already in DC. There's huge synergy there. In any given year, the two teams would be the best in Virginia, DC and Maryland combined. Can't pass that up. Not in such a good recruiting area and large/growing media market.

[yorost]

Why are we so ready to label VCU a long term power?

[thegalen]

I don't take much stock in coaches putting roots down. They have the money to live well, why shouldn't they? You bring in a program, not a coach.

I agree with your last sentence. I disagree, or at least I think the proof is in the pudding with regard to your first sentence. Would Stevens or Smart go to an Ohio State or UCLA or Kentucky or UNC or Indiana? Yeah, maybe. Other than that, both of them have already turned down very lucrative offers. Again, if Butler and VCU become destination jobs like Marquette or Georgetown, there's no reason to think either coach is leaving anytime soon.

[thegalen]

Why are we so ready to label VCU a long term power?

Label them whatever you want. I don't think chest thumping about tourney runs in the 1970s have any more bearing on future success than recent Final Fours do. Time will tell, but I think enough pieces of the puzzle add up on VCU's side of the ledger. It just makes sense.

[yorost]

Why are we so ready to label VCU a long term power?

Label them whatever you want. I don't think chest thumping about tourney runs in the 1970s have any more bearing on future success than recent Final Fours do. Time will tell, but I think enough pieces of the puzzle add up on VCU's side of the ledger. It just makes sense.

Sustained success and past laurels mean a lot, actually. I grew up a Packer fan in the 80's. They stunk but I knew they had once been great and it kept interest up across the state. When they returned to success all those past glories allowed them to hook people very quickly. DI also has 300+ teams, anyone that claim a modern era championship has something on others. If there were 40 teams, nobody would care about a Final Four. Being able to post success gives you and advantage, even if it is a little older.

I have far less faith in VCU remaining a power than Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette Creighton, Butler, and Xavier. I'm not even sure I have more confidence in them staying as successful as St. Johns, Dayton, or even DePaul. DePaul has been a past power, there is definitely been interest to return them there. Over the next 2-3 years, I have good expectations for VCU, but not DePaul, sure. I have no more or less faith in VCU than St. Louis, but if the two programs stay pretty similar in success I'd rather have St. Louis in the conference. The only thing separating VCU and St. Louis in recent program success is VCU's Cinderella run. It is a notch for VCU, but not one that inspires me to think they outclass St. Louis.

I don't take much stock in coaches putting roots down. They have the money to live well, why shouldn't they? You bring in a program, not a coach.

I agree with your last sentence. I disagree, or at least I think the proof is in the pudding with regard to your first sentence. Would Stevens or Smart go to an Ohio State or UCLA or Kentucky or UNC or Indiana? Yeah, maybe. Other than that, both of them have already turned down very lucrative offers. Again, if Butler and VCU become destination jobs like Marquette or Georgetown, there's no reason to think either coach is leaving anytime soon.

Oh, I hope Stevens and Smart stay put, and really like that they turned those programs down. However, they wouldn't be the first coach to unexpectedly bolt after looking content, settled, and dedicated.

[thegalen]

Why are we so ready to label VCU a long term power?

The only thing separating VCU and St. Louis in recent program success is VCU's Cinderella run. It is a notch for VCU, but not one that inspires me to think they outclass St. Louis.

Bwahaha. Right. You hang tight to those 8 precious post-1957 tournament games. We get it- you're not impressed with VCU, are really into the history of the team versus their performance over the last 40 years, and would prefer an all-private/catholic league to the best basketball conference possible. No need to dress your preferences up as something else or try to spin with false facts.

[yorost]

Don't put words in my mouth. I have no interest in religious affiliation within the conference. I'm perfectly fine with a public institution joining, even, it's just incidental not many are viable, I have no idea what you're talking about with 8 previous post 1957 tournament games. I'm not spinning any false facts. I'm perfectly fine with VCU being a member, assuming the remain a strong program. I've even indicated I don't care to have St. Louis joining, I'd rather they stop at Butler, Xavier, and Creighton, but it sounds like they have to go to 12. My problem is if VCU falls back, I'd rather have St. Louis. It stabilizes Creighton's disconnect from the conference.

[thegalen]

Huh. My mistake. With you pretending that, outside of the Final Four run, VCU and SLU are somehow equals in basketball, I assumed you had to be pushing some kind of agenda. There's another solution to your Creighton problem that doesn't involve only having 5 east coast teams....

[yorost]

No worries, hope I didn't upset you. I'm curious, what is the other solution with Creighton + 6 east coast schools? No Dayton?