UConn to the Big East? Rumors and Discussion Thread...

[kayako]

If adding UConn forces us into divisions, then I'm 100% against it. As a Xavier fan, it would be a huge loss to only see Villanova, for example, come to Cintas every other year. It completely changes the picture, and for the worse.

I understand that the long-time Big East programs are excited to play an old rival, and I do want what's best for the conference, but I'm very lukewarm about UConn. I fear they will cause nothing but friction before ultimately leaving.

If it's 2 divisions of 6 teams each (I don't want expansion past 12), you'd still get home and home with 2 teams from the other division, and that can go in rotation. Not a true round robin, but not exactly once a year either.

[stever20]

If adding UConn forces us into divisions, then I'm 100% against it. As a Xavier fan, it would be a huge loss to only see Villanova, for example, come to Cintas every other year. It completely changes the picture, and for the worse.

I understand that the long-time Big East programs are excited to play an old rival, and I do want what's best for the conference, but I'm very lukewarm about UConn. I fear they will cause nothing but friction before ultimately leaving.

If it's 2 divisions of 6 teams each (I don't want expansion past 12), you'd still get home and home with 2 teams from the other division, and that can go in rotation. Not a true round robin, but not exactly once a year either.

there won't be divisions if we went to 12. You would play 4 teams once and then the other 7 teams 2x.

[Xudash]

As unlikely as it is, I guess Yukon coming back may not be an unthinkable situation as some people claimed.

I don't care about the round robin, honestly. If Yukon comes back, bring another school in to make it 12. A Dayton, A St. Louis, or whatever best candidate isn't going to devalue this league.

If the BE can get UCONN, why would there be any rush to add a 12th team? The BE is doing great as a 10 team league. If they went to 11 with UCONN, the best thing would be to wait and see how it was working before adding an arbitrary crap 12th team like Dayton, SLU or anyone not named Notre Dame or Kansas.

Sure, there's no rush, and 11 can work for a season or two. Other than the obvious problem of a team forced into no-weekend game on most weeks, some reasons why I think expanding to 12 is a pretty safe bet:

1. The next TV deal. And whether it's coincidence or not, there's a provision in the current deal with Fox which allows for expansion to 12 teams with no decrease in payments to each schools.

2. Notre Dame is bound to the ACC for like the next 20 years, give or take a few. UCONN is a unique case. Their motivation to rejoin the BE is probably greater than a school like Cincinnati. Which is to say, I doubt there's any interest in joining the Big East among name brand schools outside of UCONN. Even with highly unlikely scenario of several current P5 schools being abandoned by the next round of realignment, they'll just form a new G5-like conference, or better yet just join the AAC. Sorry, that's just a really long way of saying what's available now is as good as it'll get.

3. 9 years left on the MSG deal. How confindent are you that we don't lose the venue to ACC? In addition to Yukon fans, ideally the BE can add another fanbase that travels well. Maybe VCU?

4. I don't think the likes of Dayton = crap. Every program has warts, and let's not act like current BE members are above that. Show me some combination of great facilities, good attendance, good academic standing, some level of sustained success, and most importantly new TV viewers, and I'm willing to listen.

5. Just from Villanova's perspective, a 20 game conference schedule would be... perhaps not the best scenario. 20 + 4 exempt tournament games + 4 Big 5 games + Big Ten challenge leaves us with very little flexibility. Yeah I'm sure we can make it work, but I would think Jay prefers 18.

I respect your criteria under #4, but, notwithstanding them, how would you feel if I proposed St. Joe's for the Big East? More specifically, how would you react if I proposed a school in your backyard for which you have no appetite for inclusion in the conference?

I doubt Xavier is going to support UD's inclusion in the Big East. Besides, I doubt the braintrust at Intergalactic HQ's in New York would go along with such soft phrasing as "some level of sustained success". They're going to want to see real, proven sustained success before they dish out coveted seats at the BE table. UD hasn't demonstrated long-term sustained success. Worse yet, their coach most likely is getting closer to leaving for another opportunity. IF UD has demonstrated anything, it has demonstrated a remarkable ability to not pick a strong succession of solid coaches.

Beyond all that, it still seems clear that the BE is looking up and long at schools that may not even be available today - - the leadership isn't seriously considering pulling from a pool of mid-major programs. We've earned that disposition.

[Dave]

odd number of teams means you can't have everyone playing on the same weekend.

So once a year your team would have to play an out of conference game during the conference schedule if they wanted to play every weekend. How is that a big deal? We already do that! Does anyone even notice?

The weekend of Jan 28/29 Nova played UVA. Seton hall did not have a weekend game on that weekend. So what?

[Hall2012]

What would even be the point of adding a 12th team? I get that an even number generally works better for scheduling and tournament bracketing, but 11 can work perfectly fine

-11 keeps the true double round robin, which is great for competitive balance in the league and adds meaning to the regular season title. There's a big reason that the Big East tournament title is considered this conference's holy grail while the regular season title is far less prestigious. In the old league, schedule imbalance gave certain teams an unfair advantage in regards to the regular season title. If the regular season champ got Rutgers, USF, and DePaul twice plus most of their tough games at home and the runner up 1 game back got Louisville, UConn, and Villanova twice...are we sure the right team got the trophy? I'm still a tourney over regular season person, but I like that fact that our setup means the best team during the season is going to get the trophy and that adds some meaning to it.
-12 forces us to use an imbalanced schedule with potential issues related to what's described above.

- 11 Scheduling isn't that big of a deal - it just means one team has a bye in every round. I don't think extra rest is an issue - looking at all the injuries a lot of teams have, I think a bunch of them would welcome an extra bye
- 12 doesn't change much, just adds an extra game to each round of the season

- 11 The 6th place team would lose it's 1st round bye in the BET to play the 11 seed on opening night. The winner of that game would then play the 3 seed. This is noteworthy because odds are that 6th place team is going to be a bubble team. Playing the 11 in their opener gives them a good chance to add a win to their resume. It's that easy +1 in the tourney. On the other hand, also a potential bad loss that could derail their bid and hurts their odds of upsetting the 3 seed as they'll be playing their 2nd straight game.
-12 The 5th place team also loses it's 1st round bye in the BET and would play the 12 seed on opening night. Same scenario as the 6 seed in the 11 scenario in that it could help or harm if they're on the bubble. It would be a boost the 4 seed if they're on the bubble as well, though I'd like to hope that would never be the case.

[NJRedman]

A couple of observations.

1. An exit fee wont keep anyone and have been lowered every time they have been brought to court. We would need a grant of rights. Much harder to break and the other conferences with them wouldn't want to challenge their legality.

2. We would not go to divisions with 12 teams.

3. The B1G played 20+ years with 11 teams. It's more than sustainable for us.

4. The 20 game round robin does not hurt our chances to get NCAA bids. Replacing dregs with UConn is a win for us. The committee has constantly shown they reward those teams that challenge themselves during the season. Thats why Gonzaga is the #4 one seed and Nova is the overall #1.

5. Getting UConn would be a boon for us and only a fool would walk away from them. With that being said, they would need to sign a GOR without question. They would also in my opinion drop FB to FCS.

[stever20]

A couple of observations.
4. The 20 game round robin does not hurt our chances to get NCAA bids. Replacing dregs with UConn is a win for us. The committee has constantly shown they reward those teams that challenge themselves during the season. Thats why Gonzaga is the #4 one seed and Nova is the overall #1.

Maryland in 2014 finished 17-15 in the ACC. had the #10 SOS in the country. Do you know what that got them? Nothing- not even a NIT bid. So how does the committee reward teams like that? Like it or not, your win-loss record matters. Until the committee starts to take teams like Maryland in 2014, I think you are wrong.

[billyjack]

Why are college teams limited to 31 games (or 29 or whatever if they don't participate in an exempt tourney)? What's the background on that rule? Why can't that rule change? If the NCAA increased that number by 2, then we could play 20 conference games and still have the 13 or whatever non-conference games.

Also, in my opinion, we should absolutely have no divisions. No divisions.

[HoosierPal]

Ship DePaul to the AAC, even up trade for UConn. Seriously.

[sciencejay]

For those that wonder why UConn leaving in a few years for the B1G/ACC, here's why: It creates the impression of weakness and instability. Perception is everything, and the BEast is fighting (and will for some time fight) the perception that it is not a power conference. Sure, Nova winning it all last year gave us extra gravitas, but the big boys will look to diminish us every chance they get. UConn leaving would add fuel to their fire. I think the conference is strong, and will maintain a strong image in the eyes of the rest of the CBB nation (including media) as long as we continue to push teams deep into the tourney. X and Nova have done well, and I hope the Jays (and Butler and Marquette and SH and...) can figure out how to get to the second weekend this year.

From my perspective, bringing UConn back into the fold would strengthen us as a CBB brand, certainly, but I would require them to drop to FCS football. The money is simply too great in FBS football to think that if one of the big conferences called, they wouldn't leave in a minute. And why shouldn't they? They would increase their football profile (and income) without damaging their MBB profile at all. And I agree that large buyouts never actually deter anyone, so a GOR agreement with Fox might help us to keep them (but of course, Fox would then want us ALL to sign GOR deals) for a time period that may be long enough to shell their FBS dreams, but maybe not. If they agree to drop to FCS status, then they are making a decision that they can't afford to continue in the FBS (with crappy G5 revenue streams), but that they want to maintain their national status in MBB (and women's BB since the BEast can't be worse in women's BB than the AAC). If they can make that kind of commitment, then I would be shocked if they left after a few years. No major conference would want their FCS football.

I would love to know the relative influences of the ADs (who presumably speak for the MBB coaches), the presidents, Val and conference execs, and Fox. From what I understood with the BigXII GOR deal, that was driven by TV contract, not conference stability (which it provided as an aside). Those decision-makers may be prioritizing many different things than we are discussing here. After all, what did Rothstein report that was inconsistent with VA's recent comments that "while we are always open to expansion, we are not actively pursuing that as of now (more paraphrase than quoting here)"? Speaking to UConn could be considered 'keeping channels open' rather than 'actively pursuing a deal'.