2017 Recruiting Class Could Be The Best Yet

[adoraz]

Disclaimer: I don't want to come off negative because overall I am happy with where the BE is recruiting wise.

This is waaaaay too premature. I completely disagree that 25% of the class having committed is enough to judge where things are at, especially since only 7 of the Top 50 have committed. More importantly, of those 43 remaining in top 50, only 2 or 3 look like they have a decent chance of ending up in the Big East. While racking up the quantity of 4 stars is great, getting the top tier, 5 star talent is just as important. Once these top 50 guys start landing at non-BE schools, the BE schools will fall down the rankings pretty quickly.

This is the time when recruiting and commitments really heat up though so in about a month or so I'm sure the picture will look very different.

We have a good chance with 3 top 50 (50% or higher on crystal ball). Why are some people so fixated on top 50, anyways? We only had 2 in 2016, which is an excellent class. Top recruits are defined by 4 or 5 stars. Big East usually doesn't get many the top 50 one and done caliber players, but we do very well with 50-150. With 4 and 5 stars, based on our current commitments (6) and crystal ball (see row above post), we are tracking for an excellent year.

First off, the crystal ball is an extremely inaccurate attention grab for 247. Although that also means we could end up with an unexpected top 50 prospect or two as well.

The main reason I referenced the Top 50 players (which I saw Stever actually beat me to) is because you are constantly referencing where the BE teams current fall in the rankings. Once these top 50 kids start committing the BE teams are going to fall quite a bit since it's very likely they won't be getting many of them. All I'm saying is that it's shaping up to be a very nice year of recruiting for the BE but I think you are overreacting based on current class rankings.

As I mentioned in the OP, obviously we won't finish with 9 top 50 classes. That's not what I'm getting at. The fact we currently have recruiting class rankings this high now are a testament to the fact we already have a good class (again, 6 four stars which is roughly half the number of 4 and 5 stars we had the last two classes). We already are seeing very strong results. The title says we could end up with our best class. I don't think it's an overreaction, I think it's a very real possibility. At the least I think we should end up with one of our better classes.

I only mentioned 247 Crystal Ball because you and Stever brought up future results. There's no other way to measure it, but crystal ball looks pretty positive and IMO contributes to the idea that we'll finish with a very strong class.

[adoraz]

I think everyone is too worried about Top 25/50 and how many 4-5 star guys we get. First of all, we are never going to compete with Duke & UKs for one and dones. In the immediate future, these two schools are going to get the best Top 15 kids annually. That's really OK. They've got a formula that they think will work, and we have to stick to a formula that we think will work. We just have to keep getting good to very good talent (don't need "one and done great" necessarily) and let our excellent coaches coach them up. Sprinkle in some transfers who can make immediate impacts (who are not factored in to recruiting rankings) and we get to see a more complete picture. If you look at CU Jays' recruiting classes the last 4 years, they've been decent but they don't nearly reflect the talent they'll have on the floor this year with addition of Mo W. and Foster as transfers.

Additionally if you are going to focus on who is coming in, you should also focus on who is going out. I'll compare UK & Duke to my own team, Nova. UK and Duke brought in stud PG's (Fox and Jackson), stud PF's (Giles and Adebayo), stud wings (Monk & Tatum). Now, they are going to war with those 6 as their core players for this year. Nova, conversely, is countering with Brunson (PG), Jenkins (PF) and Hart (wing). None of those 3 were ranked higher than any of the 6 from UK/Duke but I feel pretty good about competing with them this year. They're more experienced, battle-tested physically mature, more advanced BB IQ, etc. So when we look at these rankings year after year and see Duke, UK, KU, Syr, Ariz and don't highlight the guys that also leave early, what does it really matter? Ulis and Murray are no longer on UK, and Sumner and Bluett are still on X. So why are we focusing on the fact that UK is bringing in studs for 2016, and X is not. Who's in better shape in their backcourt & wings for 2016-17. I'd say X.

I get that we need to keep getting talent. We do. But I'm more concerned with having balanced teams and balanced recruiting classes. Give me a 3/4* Jr/Sr over a 5* Frosh any day.

Alot of truth in here. There are basically 4 schools that get loads of 1 & dones: Arizona, Duke, UK and Kansas. Those 4 will dominate the top 20 every year so the rankings can be deceiving. That being said, X is looking to have its best recruiting class yet next year so I don't disagree with the OP that next year could be great. Just disagree that the current rankings reflect that.

It's definitely possible we don't end up with our best class, but I think current results are positive and reflect that we could. I think we should easily beat the 2015 class and follow up a strong 2016 class with another strong one.

As for Xavier, when I looked through the crystal ball rankings (in response to Stever), I noticed that they should have an excellent class (as you know). Favored with a lot of top recruits.

[stever20]

Disclaimer: I don't want to come off negative because overall I am happy with where the BE is recruiting wise.

This is waaaaay too premature. I completely disagree that 25% of the class having committed is enough to judge where things are at, especially since only 7 of the Top 50 have committed. More importantly, of those 43 remaining in top 50, only 2 or 3 look like they have a decent chance of ending up in the Big East. While racking up the quantity of 4 stars is great, getting the top tier, 5 star talent is just as important. Once these top 50 guys start landing at non-BE schools, the BE schools will fall down the rankings pretty quickly.

This is the time when recruiting and commitments really heat up though so in about a month or so I'm sure the picture will look very different.

We have a good chance with 3 top 50 (50% or higher on crystal ball). Why are some people so fixated on top 50, anyways? We only had 2 in 2016, which is an excellent class. Top recruits are defined by 4 or 5 stars. Big East usually doesn't get many the top 50 one and done caliber players, but we do very well with 50-150. With 4 and 5 stars, based on our current commitments (6) and crystal ball (see row above post), we are tracking for an excellent year.

First off, the crystal ball is an extremely inaccurate attention grab for 247. Although that also means we could end up with an unexpected top 50 prospect or two as well.

The main reason I referenced the Top 50 players (which I saw Stever actually beat me to) is because you are constantly referencing where the BE teams current fall in the rankings. Once these top 50 kids start committing the BE teams are going to fall quite a bit since it's very likely they won't be getting many of them. All I'm saying is that it's shaping up to be a very nice year of recruiting for the BE but I think you are overreacting based on current class rankings.

yeah using the current class rankings is a joke right now, considering only 54 schools have even 1 player. Only 54 schools with a player.

As to the question about why fixated on the top 50. Because there aren't many of those that have committed. More of the 51-100 guys have committed. 1-50 has all of 10 commitments so far. 51-100 has 16. Already 40 of the at least 4 stars by 247 composite have committed- out of 140.. So- top 50- 10/50 committed. Non top 50 at least 4 stars- 30/90 committed.

[adoraz]

No response to my rebuttal Stever? Sticking to your one talking point and ignoring the success (and likely future success) we've had so far?

The current rankings reflect we are actually signing high ranking recruits already. Something other conferences aren't capable of. Nobody expects the class rankings to remain as they are, but there's much more to this you're ignoring.

[SJHooper]

As a huge diehard SJ fan, I hear the words "should", "could", "may" and "possibly" a lot. I also hear the words "palpable buzz" a lot surrounding us. This gets boring after a while. It gets old. We can recruit and recruit. We can market on the LIRR and have commercials on FS1. We can talk about renovating CA. We can talk about 1985 even though that might as well have been 100 years ago. At a certain point, we actually MUST produce. It's kind of like the Knicks...always tons of buzz getting new big time free agents and big time trades. Then it never pans out. New York is a results town. What have you done for me lately? Even the Yankees are dead right now. 27 rings, the most recently only 7 years ago, but guess what? Today, no one cares. Today, the Mets are more popular, because they are relevant NOW. My point is that we need to demand results. We need to become a program that "has", "does", "did", and most importantly "won". In New York "what have you done for me lately" City, 1985 might as well be 1712.

Sorry to go off topic, but the two are connected. I have very low expectations for recruits or really anything involved with our basketball program because it's so painful when they fail to live up to hype every year. We will recruit...we already are. That is not the concern. The concern is: can Mullin motivate players, can he get the right pieces to the puzzle, can he get us to win consistently, and can he develop their skills and get the most out of them? Recruiting is not the problem and I'm happy with it. But we need to be able to place blame if these ultra talented kids fall flat again.

[stever20]

the response is that of the guys that have signed- a far bigger percentage of the ones that have signed are the guys 51-140. 30/90 vs 10/50. 1/3 vs 1/5. 33% vs 20%. And the thing is the group that hasn't had many signees yet is the top 50- and Big East doesn't get that many of those.

And the bigger point is recruiting isn't ahead of where it is normally. Big East gets a lot of guys early in the process(as the guys in the 2nd tier group commit earlier). That's just how it falls. A lot of times the 2nd tier kids want to be done with the process. Top 50 guys aren't like that- they want to draw it out as long as possible(and some have started signing even after the season).

Also, wouldn't call a year where we didn't have a single top 20 class as a strong recruiting class.

[milksteak]

I'll fill you guys in with Butler. We are having a great summer. Here's where we stand:

-Top Seven for 4-star/48th SG Jordan Goodwin, Rest of list: Illinois, Northwestern, SLU, Alabama, Creighton, Missouri
-Top Five for 4-star/80th SF Kyle Young, Rest of list: Michigan, Ohio State, Clemson, Purdue
-Top Five for 4-star/93rd SG Christian David, Rest of list: Creighton, Miami, Oregon, Pittsburgh
-Top Six for 4-star/94th PG Isaiah Washington (no offer), Rest of list: Minnesota, Providence, Xavier, Georgia Tech, Syracuse
-Top Seven for 4-star/96th PG Lavar Batts, Rest of list: Clemson, Florida State, Georgia, Nebraska, Oklahoma, VCU
-Top Seven for 4-star/135th SF Andre Rafus, Rest of list: NC State, Kansas, Georgetown, TCU, Seton Hall, Kentucky
-Top Seven for 3-star/216th SG Parker Stewart (no offer), Rest of list: Ole Miss, Kansas State, Georgetown, Wyoming, LSU, Nebraska
-Some traction with 3-star/152nd CG Jamal Johnson. Also being recruited by Alabama, Georgia, Memphis, Ole Miss, UAB and Wake Forest

Hopefully, we can get a couple. We desperately need guards/wings for this class, so that's why you see some overlap.

[DudeAnon]

Following up on Milksteaks post. Here is Xavier's recruiting image right now:

6 available spots for 2017 (presuming Bluiett and Sumner leave)
Signed:
Jared Ridder - 3 stars (131) https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/3303

In the lead for:
Paul Scruggs - 4 stars (33) http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... ul-scruggs
Naji Marshall - 4 stars (59) http://247sports.com/Player/Naji-Marshall-85205

There is obviously a lot more happening than just that. But If we get Scruggs and Marshall this could very easily be the best class in Xavier's history.

[JohnW22]

Following up on Milksteaks post. Here is Xavier's recruiting image right now:

6 available spots for 2017 (presuming Bluiett and Sumner leave)
Signed:
Jared Ridder - 3 stars (131) https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/3303

In the lead for:
Paul Scruggs - 4 stars (33) http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... ul-scruggs
Naji Marshall - 4 stars (59) http://247sports.com/Player/Naji-Marshall-85205

There is obviously a lot more happening than just that. But If we get Scruggs and Marshall this could very easily be the best class in Xavier's history.

I'd also say Xavier is in the lead for
Elias Harden - 4 Star (96) http://www.scout.com/player/190295-elias-harden

Also Naji Marshall is set to decide sometime before Saturday between Xavier and South Carolina. He tweeted earlier he is commiting Friday deleted it then tweeted "Decision coming sooner than you think"

[adoraz]

That'd be huge if Marshall signs this weekend. Another 4 star top 100 player (and close to top 50!).