Value of College Hoops Teams

[UD Flyer Fanatic]

No point to make here, I was just surfing the net trying to get some interesting data, and came across this from 2010 CNN Money. I do appreciate that things can change greatly in 6 years. But anyway.... does seem the stadium situation makes a great impact on expenses. (I just chose the 3 BE schools at random as those $$ seem calculated more alike).

That's it from me on this topic- time for a Sunday BBQ with family. All the best in the Championship game!

2010 CNN Money
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Here's the breakdown on the revenue, expenses and profits of all the Division I college basketball programs. The comparison between basketball revenues and profits is interesting, but not precise. That's because schools have latitude in their filings with the Department of Education in whether they attribute some expenses and revenues to a specific sport or a more general classification for their entire athletic department.

School------------------Revenue--------Exp------------Profit----------Margin
Georgetown Univ-----10,700,309------7,405,214----2,295,095-----23.70%
Marquette University- 13,446,395-----10,306,548---3,139,847-----23.40%
University of Dayton--9,091,521------3,401,333----5,690,188-----62.60%
Xavier University------8,791,518------3,938,466----4,853,052-----55.20%

[XtoDC]

My guess is if you took a poll of random people and asked them if they were a fan of Georgetown or Dayton (and excluded the no fun people who had zero opinion or had never heard of them), Georgetown would probably garner 80% of the response. I don't think anyone doubts that Georgetown wins the casual fan vote between the two. That 20% of Dayton fans though are much more passionate and actually put dollars behind their fandom, whereas I don't believe that is the case with Georgetown.

People love to shit on UD for it's location, but nobody ever seems to care about Big State U that is located in the middle of nowhere because it has STATE in its name. Dayton is not in the middle of nowhere as much as people try to say, and Dayton totally owns that market. Those Dayton fans totally put their money where their mouth is, and I admire that. In a niche sport like college basketball, that has a TON of value vs. a place like Saint Louis which is in a big market but nobody cares.

(FYI this is strictly relating to the Value of their program. This is not a case for whether or not they suck as a program or should be invited to the Big East. Just that they do have value in relation to other college basketball programs.)

[scoscox]

What accounts for GTown and Marquette's higher expenses? Is that primarily arena related?

[DudeAnon]

What accounts for GTown and Marquette's higher expenses? Is that primarily arena related?

Yup. Georgetown and Marquette rent an NBA arena whereas X owns theirs. I wouldnt take these articles too seriously. There are 10 different ones every year and each ranking teams differently.

[UD Flyer Fanatic]

What accounts for GTown and Marquette's higher expenses? Is that primarily arena related?

Yup. Georgetown and Marquette rent an NBA arena whereas X owns theirs. I wouldnt take these articles too seriously. There are 10 different ones every year and each ranking teams differently.

Don't disagree- but the one salient fact that can't be disputed is that there simply are select D1 schools that make lots of profit from their MBB program based on 1) their program's support & 2) their business model (owning a stadium like X & UD). Profitability & financial strength then is separate from "branding"- which creates the confusion how Georgetown could possibly be rated lower that UD. Based on MBB program profit, UD currently would lead the A10- and yes likely the entire BE (though I have not taken the time to see Creighton's profits, etc).

That said, the TV deal does mean an advantage for the BE schools in terms of a revenue stream that others may not enjoy. Thus no doubt in future years X will pass UD based on the TV deal. BUT while many intuitively think of UD as a mid-major- they are not in the financial world of D1 MBB.

This also should put to rest any fear that adding UD to the BE would mean weakening the BE by adding a bottom dweller. With the inherent financial strength of the UD basketball program, adding the BE TV deal and adding the prestige of being in the BE for recruiting would make UD a very competitive program in short order.

[Xudash]

What accounts for GTown and Marquette's higher expenses? Is that primarily arena related?

Yup. Georgetown and Marquette rent an NBA arena whereas X owns theirs. I wouldnt take these articles too seriously. There are 10 different ones every year and each ranking teams differently.

Don't disagree- but the one salient fact that can't be disputed is that there simply are select D1 schools that make lots of profit from their MBB program based on 1) their program's support & 2) their business model (owning a stadium like X & UD). Profitability & financial strength then is separate from "branding"- which creates the confusion how Georgetown could possibly be rated lower that UD. Based on MBB program profit, UD currently would lead the A10- and yes likely the entire BE (though I have not taken the time to see Creighton's profits, etc).

That said, the TV deal does mean an advantage for the BE schools in terms of a revenue stream that others may not enjoy. Thus no doubt in future years X will pass UD based on the TV deal. BUT while many intuitively think of UD as a mid-major- they are not in the financial world of D1 MBB.

This also should put to rest any fear that adding UD to the BE would mean weakening the BE by adding a bottom dweller. With the inherent financial strength of the UD basketball program, adding the BE TV deal and adding the prestige of being in the BE for recruiting would make UD a very competitive program in short order.

Part of UD's profits have recently come from NCAA Tournament Revenue largely derived from Xavier's time in the A10, though UD has been contributing its own Tournament revenue over the last three years.

But the larger point is that Xavier's transition to the Big East caused it to forfeit its share of that revenue, which it gladly did in order to join the Big East. This timing/transition issue will now correct for the entire Big East conference as we continue to build our revenue stream from the Tournament, including this year's $20 million performance.

Look for Xavier's number to jump a little more after this year, due to it achieving capacity performance that exceeded 100%.

Otherwise, I believe it's difficult to separate brand value from profitability and financial strength.

Lastly, and I'm not picking at you or picking a fight, but it is a fact that UD's performance as a member of the A10 has been less than stellar, to be polite. It enjoys resources that should allow it to perform at the top of the A10, yet, even this year, with Xavier, Temple and Butler removed by three years, UD barely backed into a 3 way tie for that conference title, and then failed again to win its conference tournament.

[BEX]

We love the round robin. Adding teams would put us back in the dreaded pod system with unbalanced schedules. 4.2m TV money vs 350k in the A-10 + 2m from the tournament ain't bad. Beauty of having just 10 teams. And lose one, you get another shot.

[Xudash]

We love the round robin. Adding teams would put us back in the dreaded pod system with unbalanced schedules. 4.2m TV money vs 350k in the A-10 + 2m from the tournament ain't bad. Beauty of having just 10 teams. And lose one, you get another shot.

Exactly. The overwhelming point is that we don't need to add any program at this point. At any point where we would consider doing so, all those boxes Val mentioned suggests that the targeted program or programs would have to be rather "distinguished."

Value is A box, and a number of programs have the capacity to check positive on it.