Conference realignment discussion - v. 2015

[stever20]

This thread is 53 pages long so please excuse this question but does the BE have to expand past the 10 current teams? What would make the BE have to expand?

If they want to expand, they need to be very careful on who they select. UD/SLU/Richmond/VCU are bland and offer very little to the league that is doesn't already have.

I can see shooting for the stars in expansion by trying to get UCONN back in if UCONN finds a place for their crappy football team. I also don't see why if UCONN was added that the BE would have to add a 12th team, just to get to 12 teams. The B10 played with 11 teams for years.

As far as UD goes, in a vacuum they would have been a decent add to the conference before XU and Butler were selected. Now they make no sense at all. Sorry.

I think there are reasons why the Big East would go to 12 instead of just 11 with UConn....
1- tournament. Would be able to have 2 sessions in the 1st round. This makes the league conservatively 750k (15k *50) just in 1 extra session.
2- schedule. Would be able to have everyone play each rotation. No byes necessary. Means everyone is able to play on the weekend every weekend.
3- TV. Would have more selections each rotation, which means tv would be able to select better games.

While you may find Dayton/VCU bland, the basketball world doesn't. While they are teams that you don't go from 10 to 12 based on, they are definitely teams that you go from 11 to 12 on and reap the benefits that come with that.

UCONN is a no brainer but no other potential candidate is so I'd rather pass on 1, 2 and 3 above with 11 strong teams than add a 12th team just to get to 12.

Yes they do. People on the east coast don't care about follow and know much about UD or SLU. Same goes for the mid westerners in regards to Richmond and VCU.

I think it's pretty safe to say that the powers in charge would completely disagree with you. Dayton and VCU are a whole hell of a lot better than you are giving them credit for. To get a program that has been to the elite 8 in the last 5 years and kept on going? They are way good enough to be #12.

And frankly Fox would probably demand getting a 12th to be able to glean the benefits of it. Going 11 only marginally helps them out.

[GoldenWarrior11]

I don't think it's a foregone conclusion at all that the Big 12 will get to have a CCG with only 10 teams. I think all Bowlsby did was do hope speak there. They don't want to expand, but I think the other P5 conferences are going to kind of force their hands.

That could be, but I also view the P5 as trying to lock out the G5 - that would involve working together to change the rules regarding conference championships. I can't see Texas as wanting anything to do with Cincinnati/Memphis/UCF/USF. No available school can replace A&M/Nebraska/Missouri/Colorado, so why fill with schools that are clearly below that level?

[MUBoxer]

Changed my mind about Dayton. I think they're the best option available and while some of their fan base needs a reality check on where they stand in the overall basketball world (particular if they were to join the big east) they would be somewhat beneficial. Not saying we should expand just for them as Notre Dame or UConn or Cinci or Memphis or temple are actually national powerhouses Id take in a heartbeat. But Daytons a decent program with some success and certainly wouldn't be a laugh of an expansion.

[_lh]

[/quote]I think it's pretty safe to say that the powers in charge would completely disagree with you. Dayton and VCU are a whole hell of a lot better than you are giving them credit for. To get a program that has been to the elite 8 in the last 5 years and kept on going? They are way good enough to be #12.

And frankly Fox would probably demand getting a 12th to be able to glean the benefits of it. Going 11 only marginally helps them out.[/quote]

No offense but you have no clue what the powers in charge think.

If UD and/or VCU made so much sense the BE would have already added them. Neither brings much the BE doesn't already have.

VCU just lost their rock star and Archie won't make UD a long time home either.

[stever20]

I don't think it's a foregone conclusion at all that the Big 12 will get to have a CCG with only 10 teams. I think all Bowlsby did was do hope speak there. They don't want to expand, but I think the other P5 conferences are going to kind of force their hands.

That could be, but I also view the P5 as trying to lock out the G5 - that would involve working together to change the rules regarding conference championships. I can't see Texas as wanting anything to do with Cincinnati/Memphis/UCF/USF. No available school can replace A&M/Nebraska/Missouri/Colorado, so why fill with schools that are clearly below that level?

The thing is, I see the Big Ten, SEC, and Pac 12 as seeing the Big 12 was having a huge advantage with regards to stuff like playoff money. If say Big 12 and ACC both get 90 million dollars from playoff money- Big 12 teams get 9 mil each while ACC teams get 6.4 million each. You do that over a prolonged period, and it adds up.

Even compare the Big 12 and Big Ten/SEC....
3 year period-
Big 12 schools get 23 million
Big Ten/SEC schools get 16.4 million

you really think that's going to stick? Not a chance.

The P5/G5 thing is completely separate from this.

[ArmyVet]

While you may find Dayton/VCU bland, the basketball world doesn't. While they are teams that you don't go from 10 to 12 based on, they are definitely teams that you go from 11 to 12 on and reap the benefits that come with that.

This is where you are way, way off. The basketball world truly only cares about a half dozen teams or less: Kansas, Duke, UNC, Kentucky. There are no benefits to adding mid-major teams if we want to be a major basketball league.

[Gopher+RamFan]

While you may find Dayton/VCU bland, the basketball world doesn't. While they are teams that you don't go from 10 to 12 based on, they are definitely teams that you go from 11 to 12 on and reap the benefits that come with that.

This is where you are way, way off. The basketball world truly only cares about a half dozen teams or less: Kansas, Duke, UNC, Kentucky. There are no benefits to adding mid-major teams if we want to be a major basketball league.

I guess it would depend on who the "basketball world" is defined as. A lot of people care about the P5 programs (the ratings back it) of course no where near the football ratings. If the BE wants to be a major power it ends increased viewership, consistent Top 25 teams throughout the season, deep March runs. Will Dayton and VCU bring that? They've gone deep into the tournament before, one of them has been ranked consistently in the last two seasons. Both would travel to MSG.

Dayton brings a lot of viewers (although they watch ANY basketball - lots of viewers of non Dayton games in that DMA) and a traveling fanbase for MSG.

VCU has a larger fanbase (it's great to have 30k student body, as well as another 20k working for VCU) where the only revenue producing sport is basketball- and show up more than Dayton in NY. People cared enough last year when central Virginias CBS station chose to show the A10 championship (VCU/SLU) over the ACC championship (UVA/Duke) for the first time in my memory. Most people would probably write off Virginia as ACC country, but not exactly true.

[Hoopfan]

Dunno how to multi quote so....


_lh - who do you think #11 is if not dayton or VCu?

MUboxer - every fan base has an idiot poster or two but they don't make up the whole fan base. Even us dayton fans cant stand a few posters.

Army vet - i dont know who you follow but considering any teams for expansion a mid major is same as calling teams already in BE a mid major. These teams all have very similar profiles. These arnt blue bloods but not mid major

[MUBoxer]

Dunno how to multi quote so....


_lh - who do you think #11 is if not dayton or VCu?

MUboxer - every fan base has an idiot poster or two but they don't make up the whole fan base. Even us dayton fans cant stand a few posters.

Army vet - i dont know who you follow but considering any teams for expansion a mid major is same as calling teams already in BE a mid major. These teams all have very similar profiles. These arnt blue bloods but not mid major

I agree every fan base has "those people" but I mean we had a Dayton troll on muscoop before the new big east was even a thing telling us how dayton was a far superior team, program and market. The old espn comments section used to get filled with dayton fans comments about how the A10 would laugh away the C7 if we came to them for membership. And then the handful of people on here who have a screw loose. Plus rushing the streets for an elite 8... Is well small time. I get that it's not everybody but the crazies seem to be more prevalent amongst dayton fans.

[paulxu]

2 years, and 54 pages in this thread, and not a whole lot has changed from this article about possible candidates:

http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basket ... -henderson