College Basketball Countdown

[R to the OB]

How in the world is Creighton #85 and SJU is #98? SJU returns a ton of talent. Sampson was a wasted talent as someone said before. Great athlete, but actually hurt the team taking 20 foot shots instead of driving hard in the paint. We have Harrison (shooting threat from anywhere) and Jordan (can get to the rim almost at will) leading the guards and bring back 40% 3 PT shooting Greene who is sorely underrated IMO. Add to that the best shot blocker in college hoops coming back and now we bring in a 7 footer and the top JUCO rebounder who has been called an animal for his rebounding skills. We will have well-seasoned veterans with serious talent.

On the other hand Creighton loses basically everyone who mattered nationally. No Doug aka the best player in their history bar none. No Wragge who seemingly made 3's at will for most of the season. No Gibbs who was Doug's right hand man. Creighton loses basically everyone and they are 13 spots better than SJU with well seasoned 4 and 5 star veterans? I think the ranking has more to do with SJU's "cursed" perception than the actual talent. The only major advantage Creighton has over SJU is a coach who can get the most out of his players. If SJU is #98 Creighton should be in the 120's.

The authors must have considered coaching when doing their rankings.

Wait, I thought McDermott couldn't coach... he failed at Iowa State and only succeeded at Creighton because of his son.

[stever20]

I think one thing just looking at Ken-Pom- of their 5 top players from last year- 3 are back(Brooks, Chapman, Artino). Dingman got a lot of pt when Gibbs was injured last year- some invaluable experience right in the middle of the Big East season. Don't think the cupboard is quite as bare as some think.

Also- for St John's- given that in the last 11 years they've won more than 20 only 1x in that span- it's easy to be in a prove it kind of mode. St John's isn't going to get the respect until they actually start to produce. Part of that is coaching- Steve Lavin now in his last 5 years coaching is a whopping 81-79.

[hoyahooligan]

I think one thing just looking at Ken-Pom- of their 5 top players from last year- 3 are back(Brooks, Chapman, Artino). Dingman got a lot of pt when Gibbs was injured last year- some invaluable experience right in the middle of the Big East season. Don't think the cupboard is quite as bare as some think.

Also- for St John's- given that in the last 11 years they've won more than 20 only 1x in that span- it's easy to be in a prove it kind of mode. St John's isn't going to get the respect until they actually start to produce. Part of that is coaching- Steve Lavin now in his last 5 years coaching is a whopping 81-79.

Depends on how you define their top 5 players, clearly you're doing it by % of possessions used. But that's not the only way to do it.

By % of minutes use they lose 1, 3, 4, 5.
By Ortg (adjusted for minutes) they lose 1, 2, 3, 4 and even unadjusted for that its 1,2,3,5.

[stever20]

I think one thing just looking at Ken-Pom- of their 5 top players from last year- 3 are back(Brooks, Chapman, Artino). Dingman got a lot of pt when Gibbs was injured last year- some invaluable experience right in the middle of the Big East season. Don't think the cupboard is quite as bare as some think.

Also- for St John's- given that in the last 11 years they've won more than 20 only 1x in that span- it's easy to be in a prove it kind of mode. St John's isn't going to get the respect until they actually start to produce. Part of that is coaching- Steve Lavin now in his last 5 years coaching is a whopping 81-79.

Depends on how you define their top 5 players, clearly you're doing it by % of possessions used. But that's not the only way to do it.

By % of minutes use they lose 1, 3, 4, 5.
By Ortg (adjusted for minutes) they lose 1, 2, 3, 4 and even unadjusted for that its 1,2,3,5.

I guess my point is that you can look at it like the cupboard isn't bare right now though. they add a top 100 recruit as well.

[Wizard of Westroads]

Marquette at 64, 6th in the league.

Final Projection:
Coach Wojciechowski has some decisions to make. There are basically three point guards who can start and no centers. It may work out nicely since a couple of those point guards will probably be on the floor at the same time as Marquette finds ways to win while playing small. However, that could be a huge problem on the glass and defensively. The non-conference schedule is manageable enough and the Big East has enough winnable games for this group to stay above .500 and earn a postseason berth of some sort.

[SJHooper]

We need a strong Creighton consistently to keep the Big East respectable. I'm glad we have them with us and they pulled a lot of the weight this past season for everyone. But that doesn't mean I can't be honest. This season will tell us a lot about Creighton. If they have a respectable season i.e. at least 17 wins overall, then I'd be very impressed and confident that they can always compete at this level. Creighton arguably lost more talent and proven studs than anyone in the country in terms of their value to the team. So you can't turn around and say "Hey, maybe they make the tourney somehow!". It's just being blind and setting yourself up for failure. As I said…who is going to throw down 30-40 points in a game like it's easy? Artino? He's good but no way is he close to that good. The guy shot great from anywhere on the court even with hands in his face and good defense. No one else on Creighton can do that.

Butler has more to prove because they had great difficulty competing. They looked like a true mid major last year and got trounced by non-NCAA teams. I'm a lot more worried about them than Creighton, but Creighton has been so good and so relevant in college hoops due to McDermott the past 4 years that it really gets me nervous to see what happens without him and his crew on the team.

With that said, here's to no injuries, good luck recruiting, and some pleasant surprises this season.

[R to the OB]

We need a strong Creighton consistently to keep the Big East respectable. I'm glad we have them with us and they pulled a lot of the weight this past season for everyone. But that doesn't mean I can't be honest. This season will tell us a lot about Creighton. If they have a respectable season i.e. at least 17 wins overall, then I'd be very impressed and confident that they can always compete at this level. Creighton arguably lost more talent and proven studs than anyone in the country in terms of their value to the team. So you can't turn around and say "Hey, maybe they make the tourney somehow!". It's just being blind and setting yourself up for failure. As I said…who is going to throw down 30-40 points in a game like it's easy? Artino? He's good but no way is he close to that good. The guy shot great from anywhere on the court even with hands in his face and good defense. No one else on Creighton can do that.

Butler has more to prove because they had great difficulty competing. They looked like a true mid major last year and got trounced by non-NCAA teams. I'm a lot more worried about them than Creighton, but Creighton has been so good and so relevant in college hoops due to McDermott the past 4 years that it really gets me nervous to see what happens without him and his crew on the team.

With that said, here's to no injuries, good luck recruiting, and some pleasant surprises this season.

Obviously you have absolutely no idea about Creighton's history. Seems like every few years we lose "the best player in Creighton history" and instead of falling into obscurity, we continue to be competitive and win. We've had Benoit Benjamin, Chad Gallagher, Bob Harstad, Rodney Buford, Kyle Korver, Anthony Tolliver, Nate Funk, Nick Bahe, and Booker Woodfox become stars and then leave. We continued to remain a top MVC team and we will continue to be a top Big East team without Doug McDermott. We will take a step back this year, but don't expect the Jays to stay down and become irrelevant. It's not what this program has done.
As I said earlier, it really, really sounds like you are obsessed with Creighton and are looking forward to their impending doom (as you can't seem to stop talking about it, even when evidence is presented against your position.)

[jaybydna]

We need a strong Creighton consistently to keep the Big East respectable. I'm glad we have them with us and they pulled a lot of the weight this past season for everyone. But that doesn't mean I can't be honest. This season will tell us a lot about Creighton. If they have a respectable season i.e. at least 17 wins overall, then I'd be very impressed and confident that they can always compete at this level. Creighton arguably lost more talent and proven studs than anyone in the country in terms of their value to the team. So you can't turn around and say "Hey, maybe they make the tourney somehow!". It's just being blind and setting yourself up for failure. As I said…who is going to throw down 30-40 points in a game like it's easy? Artino? He's good but no way is he close to that good. The guy shot great from anywhere on the court even with hands in his face and good defense. No one else on Creighton can do that.

Butler has more to prove because they had great difficulty competing. They looked like a true mid major last year and got trounced by non-NCAA teams. I'm a lot more worried about them than Creighton, but Creighton has been so good and so relevant in college hoops due to McDermott the past 4 years that it really gets me nervous to see what happens without him and his crew on the team.

With that said, here's to no injuries, good luck recruiting, and some pleasant surprises this season.

Those are fair thoughts. Here are my biased thoughts. We lost a lot of experience and basketball smarts, but be gain a lot of athleticism. We spread the minutes last year, had a lot of good redshirts, and gained some studs in Harrel and Gilmore. Kreklow's experience will help too. I'm not worried about the shooting. ShooterU lives on. Our athleticism will be improved which will help on defense. If our front court matures during a respectable noncon, we will be fine.

Our noncon is good, but was built to help us win games and get experience. Realistically 9-4. Add 9 conference home games at the Clink, where few road teams win. That's another 5 wins. Steal 3 conf road games, and we are 17 - 14, conservatively. If 3 of our losses break the other way (NU, OK, GT, VU etc), we have a legit shot at the tourney. Doable?

[Professor_Bulldog]

We need a strong Creighton consistently to keep the Big East respectable. I'm glad we have them with us and they pulled a lot of the weight this past season for everyone. But that doesn't mean I can't be honest. This season will tell us a lot about Creighton. If they have a respectable season i.e. at least 17 wins overall, then I'd be very impressed and confident that they can always compete at this level. Creighton arguably lost more talent and proven studs than anyone in the country in terms of their value to the team. So you can't turn around and say "Hey, maybe they make the tourney somehow!". It's just being blind and setting yourself up for failure. As I said…who is going to throw down 30-40 points in a game like it's easy? Artino? He's good but no way is he close to that good. The guy shot great from anywhere on the court even with hands in his face and good defense. No one else on Creighton can do that.

Butler has more to prove because they had great difficulty competing. They looked like a true mid major last year and got trounced by non-NCAA teams. I'm a lot more worried about them than Creighton, but Creighton has been so good and so relevant in college hoops due to McDermott the past 4 years that it really gets me nervous to see what happens without him and his crew on the team.

With that said, here's to no injuries, good luck recruiting, and some pleasant surprises this season.

Obviously you have absolutely no idea about Creighton's history. Seems like every few years we lose "the best player in Creighton history" and instead of falling into obscurity, we continue to be competitive and win. We've had Benoit Benjamin, Chad Gallagher, Bob Harstad, Rodney Buford, Kyle Korver, Anthony Tolliver, Nate Funk, Nick Bahe, and Booker Woodfox become stars and then leave. We continued to remain a top MVC team and we will continue to be a top Big East team without Doug McDermott. We will take a step back this year, but don't expect the Jays to stay down and become irrelevant. It's not what this program has done.
As I said earlier, it really, really sounds like you are obsessed with Creighton and are looking forward to their impending doom (as you can't seem to stop talking about it, even when evidence is presented against your position.)

To be fair I think losing Bob harstad in the MVC is a touch different than losing Doug now but point taken

[Gibbsyonemoreyear!]

We need a strong Creighton consistently to keep the Big East respectable. I'm glad we have them with us and they pulled a lot of the weight this past season for everyone. But that doesn't mean I can't be honest. This season will tell us a lot about Creighton. If they have a respectable season i.e. at least 17 wins overall, then I'd be very impressed and confident that they can always compete at this level. Creighton arguably lost more talent and proven studs than anyone in the country in terms of their value to the team. So you can't turn around and say "Hey, maybe they make the tourney somehow!". It's just being blind and setting yourself up for failure. As I said…who is going to throw down 30-40 points in a game like it's easy? Artino? He's good but no way is he close to that good. The guy shot great from anywhere on the court even with hands in his face and good defense. No one else on Creighton can do that.

Butler has more to prove because they had great difficulty competing. They looked like a true mid major last year and got trounced by non-NCAA teams. I'm a lot more worried about them than Creighton, but Creighton has been so good and so relevant in college hoops due to McDermott the past 4 years that it really gets me nervous to see what happens without him and his crew on the team.

With that said, here's to no injuries, good luck recruiting, and some pleasant surprises this season.

Obviously you have absolutely no idea about Creighton's history. Seems like every few years we lose "the best player in Creighton history" and instead of falling into obscurity, we continue to be competitive and win. We've had Benoit Benjamin, Chad Gallagher, Bob Harstad, Rodney Buford, Kyle Korver, Anthony Tolliver, Nate Funk, Nick Bahe, and Booker Woodfox become stars and then leave. We continued to remain a top MVC team and we will continue to be a top Big East team without Doug McDermott. We will take a step back this year, but don't expect the Jays to stay down and become irrelevant. It's not what this program has done.
As I said earlier, it really, really sounds like you are obsessed with Creighton and are looking forward to their impending doom (as you can't seem to stop talking about it, even when evidence is presented against your position.)

Dude I was with you until you pulled out Nick Bahe. Anywho CU will compete and they may not be able to recruit in the upper echelon of the Big East for obvious reasons, but they will always field good teams and some times excellent teams. Is it College Hoops season, I mean NU football choking, that's only amusing briefly before it gets old.