Commissioner "Val"

[Bill Marsh]

You're breaking my heart. Last year St. John's scheduled a road trip vs San Francisco on a Tuesday night. Let them substitute the trip to Spokane for the trip to San Fran and find an OOC opponent closer to home instead.

That's so true yet funny & ironic given the BE's representative in today's men's lax FF is Denver! Regionalism is dead and humans are the main cause of global warming getting over both those facts will help us all better prepare for the future.

Regionalism is dead? Are you sure about that?

Also we played at SF because Lavins father was being honored at that game. They were dedicating the court in his name so obviously Steve wanted to be there and so we played them on the road. If thats your guys argument on why the Zags should be allowed in then you guys really are a few shrimp short of a cocktail.

It doesn't matter why you played that game. It was an example. Everyone plays those kinds of road games OOC, including games far away.

[Bill Marsh]

Regionalism is dead? Are you sure about that?

Also we played at SF because Lavins father was being honored at that game. They were dedicating the court in his name so obviously Steve wanted to be there and so we played them on the road. If thats your guys argument on why the Zags should be allowed in then you guys really are a few shrimp short of a cocktail.

Redman, I'm old school BE (late 80s). I'm so pro BE that even though I graduated from RU I still hate them (men's bball-wise) because I grew up a playing bball on the Seton Hall campus & became a Pirate bball fan in grade school. My point is the "regionalism is dead" comment doesn't make me happy but I just let it go after WVU & VT got in (I loved Miami getting in- road-trip!) Heck the only place the BE hasn't been over the past 20 years is the West Coast. I say let's stop letting all the WC talent go unfought for to the likes of Oregon & USC & Arizona st, etc. Gonzaga could be our gateway, just like the BE has become Creighton's gateway to the EC.

You got to admit though that if there's 3 things this wave of realignment has proved its: Rivalries are an unimportant, geography is irrelevant, and the importance of winning is for a given school is debatable (RU/Missou fb). TV $$ with the potential to make even more TV $$ going forward is all that matters.

I disagree, geography is irrelevant to the desperate. Those who have options don't tend to throw out geography. The successful conferences have expanded into neighboring regions like the B1G to the North East, the ACC to the North East and the SEC into Texarkana. The desperate without many options are the ones who have thrown out geography. The old Big East adding TCU, Boise and San Diego, the Pac-10 trying to bring in the texas and oklahoma schools, the sun belt adding new mexico and idaho.

We have reliable options, we don't NEED to expand west any further than Creighton.

A school in Spokane will not open up the talent from California to us. Thats like saying Creighton can now recruit Florida players easier. How? Each coast is pretty big.

The desperate?

The Big East added Miami when there was no one else remotely close. The ACC added BC up in New England when everyone else was from the old Confederate states.The Big XII added West Virginia. The C7 added Creighton, which was not in a contiguous state. Pac XII was all set to add Texas and Oklahoma. I guess everyone gets a little desperate at times.

Here in the East we're used to short distances between conference members. Out West they're used to much longer distances even in the P5 Pac XII, which is why Gonzaga is interested in taking on a conference with all this travel for them. Every road trip is an airplane ride anyway. Any conference out there that has Hawaii in it is guaranteed to have a Gonzaga-like road trip.

The issue here isn't a matter of being desperate, it's that Gonzaga is a perfect fit institutionally. Everyone agrees that Gonzaga would be added in a heartbeat if they were closer regardless of whether they were in a good recruiting ground or a big market just as Creighton was added based on their record. In addition, Gonzaga has demonstrated the level of commitment and organizational necessary to build a program and sustain a high level of success under two different coaches.

I completely disagree with your statement that the conference has reliable options. Despite the nice aspects to their programs that St Louis and Dayton bring, they have not proven themselves to be reliable, which is exactly the problem with those two. Neither has yet demonstrated the ability to build and sustain a successful program. I wish they would because either would be a better addition that Gonzaga if they were able to do that. VCU has done that better than any other candidate, but they're not a good fit institutionally. There is no perfect candidate out there, so a choice is going to have to be made from among less than perfect candidates.

[Bill Marsh]

Interesting points made by both Redmen & Hall. My take is Gonzaga would not have an interest in this basketball centric conference unless there is a significant west coast division. I just don't see a compelling reason for the Zags to have interest so I can't even begin to address the pros/cons of an add like Gonzaga but like I said, good points on both sides of the debate.

But to Bill Marsh is you like the Zags OOC then you must love the Dayton Flyers, I don't have the time to put the list together but over this same time frame the Flyers have wins against UNC, Louisville (2), Georgia tech, Ohio State, Syracuse , Stanford, Pittsburgh, New Mexico, Cincinnati, Alabama, Auburn, Ol Miss, Illinois, Murray St., Akron ( LOL ) , Big east Creighton, Hall, Marquette. Not including conference wins like SLU, X, at Temple, UMASS, UD also had a win versus Zags last year.

Yes, I do like Dayton and would embrace them or St Louis if either or both are added. Here we're just kicking around ideas in good humors, no attempt to belittle anyone else.

The difference I see in Gonzaga is captured in this article entitled "Gonzaga Has Top Ten Talent".

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports. ... en-talent/

[NJRedman]

Redman, I'm old school BE (late 80s). I'm so pro BE that even though I graduated from RU I still hate them (men's bball-wise) because I grew up a playing bball on the Seton Hall campus & became a Pirate bball fan in grade school. My point is the "regionalism is dead" comment doesn't make me happy but I just let it go after WVU & VT got in (I loved Miami getting in- road-trip!) Heck the only place the BE hasn't been over the past 20 years is the West Coast. I say let's stop letting all the WC talent go unfought for to the likes of Oregon & USC & Arizona st, etc. Gonzaga could be our gateway, just like the BE has become Creighton's gateway to the EC.

You got to admit though that if there's 3 things this wave of realignment has proved its: Rivalries are an unimportant, geography is irrelevant, and the importance of winning is for a given school is debatable (RU/Missou fb). TV $$ with the potential to make even more TV $$ going forward is all that matters.

I disagree, geography is irrelevant to the desperate. Those who have options don't tend to throw out geography. The successful conferences have expanded into neighboring regions like the B1G to the North East, the ACC to the North East and the SEC into Texarkana. The desperate without many options are the ones who have thrown out geography. The old Big East adding TCU, Boise and San Diego, the Pac-10 trying to bring in the texas and oklahoma schools, the sun belt adding new mexico and idaho.

We have reliable options, we don't NEED to expand west any further than Creighton.

A school in Spokane will not open up the talent from California to us. Thats like saying Creighton can now recruit Florida players easier. How? Each coast is pretty big.

The desperate?

The Big East added Miami when there was no one else remotely close. The ACC added BC up in New England when everyone else was from the old Confederate states.The Big XII added West Virginia. The C7 added Creighton, which was not in a contiguous state. Pac XII was all set to add Texas and Oklahoma. I guess everyone gets a little desperate at times.

Here in the East we're used to short distances between conference members. Out West they're used to much longer distances even in the P5 Pac XII, which is why Gonzaga is interested in taking on a conference with all this travel for them. Every road trip is an airplane ride anyway. Any conference out there that has Hawaii in it is guaranteed to have a Gonzaga-like road trip.

The issue here isn't a matter of being desperate, it's that Gonzaga is a perfect fit institutionally. Everyone agrees that Gonzaga would be added in a heartbeat if they were closer regardless of whether they were in a good recruiting ground or a big market just as Creighton was added based on their record. In addition, Gonzaga has demonstrated the level of commitment and organizational necessary to build a program and sustain a high level of success under two different coaches.

I completely disagree with your statement that the conference has reliable options. Despite the nice aspects to their programs that St Louis and Dayton bring, they have not proven themselves to be reliable, which is exactly the problem with those two. Neither has yet demonstrated the ability to build and sustain a successful program. I wish they would because either would be a better addition that Gonzaga if they were able to do that. VCU has done that better than any other candidate, but they're not a good fit institutionally. There is no perfect candidate out there, so a choice is going to have to be made from among less than perfect candidates.

Oh god i'm sick of this debate. There is a difference between moving into an adjacent region and having a satellite program on the other side of the god damn continent. Yes, the Big East added Miami, who was in the same time zone and won multiple national titles. How many national titles has the Zags won in BBall? How many Final Fours have they made? Don't even try and compare the Zags in BBall to Miami in FB.

You two can say i'm a hater, that somehow for some reason deep down i "hate" the Zags. You can call me names and what not, but tomorrow, next year and the next decade i'll still be right and the Zags won't be in the league. Let that sink in for a moment. All your posturing about all their success and how much "regionalism is dead" and "they're used to the long trips", Gonzaga will never EVER be a member of the Big East. They weren't considered when they were the #1 team in the country and they won't be considered any other time moving forward. Thank you for once again hijacking a thread about the commissioner for your obsession with a pacific northwest program.

[Bill Marsh]

I disagree, geography is irrelevant to the desperate. Those who have options don't tend to throw out geography. The successful conferences have expanded into neighboring regions like the B1G to the North East, the ACC to the North East and the SEC into Texarkana. The desperate without many options are the ones who have thrown out geography. The old Big East adding TCU, Boise and San Diego, the Pac-10 trying to bring in the texas and oklahoma schools, the sun belt adding new mexico and idaho.

We have reliable options, we don't NEED to expand west any further than Creighton.

A school in Spokane will not open up the talent from California to us. Thats like saying Creighton can now recruit Florida players easier. How? Each coast is pretty big.

The desperate?

The Big East added Miami when there was no one else remotely close. The ACC added BC up in New England when everyone else was from the old Confederate states.The Big XII added West Virginia. The C7 added Creighton, which was not in a contiguous state. Pac XII was all set to add Texas and Oklahoma. I guess everyone gets a little desperate at times.

Here in the East we're used to short distances between conference members. Out West they're used to much longer distances even in the P5 Pac XII, which is why Gonzaga is interested in taking on a conference with all this travel for them. Every road trip is an airplane ride anyway. Any conference out there that has Hawaii in it is guaranteed to have a Gonzaga-like road trip.

The issue here isn't a matter of being desperate, it's that Gonzaga is a perfect fit institutionally. Everyone agrees that Gonzaga would be added in a heartbeat if they were closer regardless of whether they were in a good recruiting ground or a big market just as Creighton was added based on their record. In addition, Gonzaga has demonstrated the level of commitment and organizational necessary to build a program and sustain a high level of success under two different coaches.

I completely disagree with your statement that the conference has reliable options. Despite the nice aspects to their programs that St Louis and Dayton bring, they have not proven themselves to be reliable, which is exactly the problem with those two. Neither has yet demonstrated the ability to build and sustain a successful program. I wish they would because either would be a better addition that Gonzaga if they were able to do that. VCU has done that better than any other candidate, but they're not a good fit institutionally. There is no perfect candidate out there, so a choice is going to have to be made from among less than perfect candidates.

Oh god i'm sick of this debate. There is a difference between moving into an adjacent region and having a satellite program on the other side of the god damn continent. Yes, the Big East added Miami, who was in the same time zone and won multiple national titles. How many national titles has the Zags won in BBall? How many Final Fours have they made? Don't even try and compare the Zags in BBall to Miami in FB.

You two can say i'm a hater, that somehow for some reason deep down i "hate" the Zags. You can call me names and what not, but tomorrow, next year and the next decade i'll still be right and the Zags won't be in the league. Let that sink in for a moment. All your posturing about all their success and how much "regionalism is dead" and "they're used to the long trips", Gonzaga will never EVER be a member of the Big East. They weren't considered when they were the #1 team in the country and they won't be considered any other time moving forward. Thank you for once again hijacking a thread about the commissioner for your obsession with a pacific northwest program.

Would never be calling you names. that's not my thing.

As far as Gonzaga being on the other side of the continent, that' true from the NYC perspective, but it sure isn't from Omaha.

It's all good. Just having some fun kicking ideas around. Appreciate your perspective. Doesn't matter to me whether we agree or disagree. In fact it's the disagreements that keep the conversation interesting.

[Bill Marsh]

UConn announced its 2014-15 schedule yesterday. It includes the following road trips:

Pal Alto, CA
San Juan, PR
Houston, TX
Dallas, TX
Tulsa, OK
New Orleans, LA
Memphis, TN
Tampa, FL
Gainesville, FL
Greenville, NC
Cincinnati, OH

[Gopher+RamFan]

How do you know a school ON the west coast won't open up the west coast for the rest of the league? What logic are you basing that on. We already know that CU in year one recruited Devin Brooks to Nebraska partially on the idea that he would play games back home on the east coast?

Also I ind your logic of geography by conference weak. Saying the B1G expansion (as a whole) makes since geographically ignores the fact of RU playing road games in Wisconsin & Iowa & Minnesota for all sports year round (doesn't sound geographically logical for RU fans) same with all the B1G schools coming out to Maryland & Jersey for all sports. You think the SEC makes geographic sense too, ignoring the distance between Florida/SC & Missouri.

Rutgers to Minnesota's campus is roughly 1,300 miles (that's about the total expanse of the B1G). The closest BE member to Gonzaga, is Creighton - at roughly 1,300 miles. The B1G expanded east, only because NYC commands so many eyeballs (just like the ACC is trying to expand its media exposure). I know your point was to showcase that distance doesn't matter to other conferences, but many people seem to discount how far the West Coast and East Coast are separated. There is a reason no other conference stretches, literally, from coast to coast.

I have a hard time seeing the Big East expanding west to capture the Spokane market. They'd be perfect if they were in Chicago.

Since Dayton fans are pimping themselves on this thread, I'll end with this: http://www.richmondbizsense.com/2014/05 ... -facility/

VCU is breaking ground next week on its $25 Million Practice Facility, to show renewed commitment to its basketball program. Not sure if the institutional fit problem will ever be able to resolved, so it may be a moot point.

[billyjack]

I mentioned this a page or 2 ago, but in December 2012, the "C-7" tossed around the idea of a "national conference". I don't remember the details of why the idea went away. Was it considered impractical...? Or was it just put on hold...? Does anyone remember?

[muskienick]

Interesting points made by both Redmen & Hall. My take is Gonzaga would not have an interest in this basketball centric conference unless there is a significant west coast division. I just don't see a compelling reason for the Zags to have interest so I can't even begin to address the pros/cons of an add like Gonzaga but like I said, good points on both sides of the debate.

But to Bill Marsh is you like the Zags OOC then you must love the Dayton Flyers, I don't have the time to put the list together but over this same time frame the Flyers have wins against UNC, Louisville (2), Georgia tech, Ohio State, Syracuse , Stanford, Pittsburgh, New Mexico, Cincinnati, Alabama, Auburn, Ol Miss, Illinois, Murray St., Akron ( LOL ) , Big east Creighton, Hall, Marquette. Not including conference wins like SLU, X, at Temple, UMASS, UD also had a win versus Zags last year.

And yet the Flyers have pretty much languished in mediocrity as a member of the A-10 (i.e. seldom contending for a regular season of Tourney title and finishing in the middle of the pack more often than not).

[muskienick]

I mentioned this a page or 2 ago, but in December 2012, the "C-7" tossed around the idea of a "national conference". I don't remember the details of why the idea went away. Was it considered impractical...? Or was it just put on hold...? Does anyone remember?

BJ,
Are you certain that the idea wasn't partially implemented already with the possibility of expanding more nationally in the future?