If Wichita St. runs the table, do they deserve a #1 seed?

[Bill Marsh]

This is a emotional discussion for Creighton fans, because WSU has been our #1 rival the last five years or so.

Do they deserve a number 1 seed if undefeated? Yes.

The only knock would their OOC schedule. However, many fanbases do not understand how hard it is for "high mid major" programs to schedule games. No BCS schools want that game. It is a lose-lose for them. If you lose, you lost to a mid major. If you win, you "only" beat a mid major. It is extremely unfair to penalize them for that.

You can also knock the MVC, but it is the 11th or so ranked conference. I don't see any teams from the 9th, 10th, 12th, 13th ranked conferences going undefeated. It is extremely difficult to do. Furthermore, it is completely out of their control.

Lastly, they made the final four last year.

It should be a no-brainer, imo.

I understand your sensitivity to the issue. But there is no way that they have qualified for a #1 seed if the same standard is applied to them as is applied to everyone else.

And the problem is not their OOC schedule. They beat a top 10-15 team OOC (St Louis). They beat two other top 50 teams OOC (BVU and Tennessee). The problem is that they Indiana State only team in the MVC even in the top 100. This is not just a mid major conference, it is a weak mid major. A #11 conference rank includes Wichita State just to get them up that high. Take away WSU from the equation and the rest of the conference would fall far and fast. They wouldn't be getting any different treatment than Memphis got when playing in the very weak CUSA of recent years.

While I sympathize with the difficulty for mid majors to schedule up, it's really not about being fair in the seedings. It's about being fair in putting championship candidates to the test. WSU should have to run as demanding a gauntlet as everyone else. The fact is that they haven't had to do that, coming into the tournament. Because of their schedule, they have been able in all likelihood than they would have if they had to play the schedule that teams from the top 6-8 conferences have to play even if they get only a #2 or 3 seed. To give them a #1 seed with the schedule that they play would be a slap in the face to every team that has had to play a demanding, rigorous schedule all year long.

If they get the 1-seed, you won'y hear a peep out of me because they will have submitted their credentials like everyone else. the committee will have spoken. But to act in advance like they've earned it, well, I just can't agree with that.

[Randy]

you and I just fundamentally disagree on the issue.

if they are 34-0 or whatever it would be, you are telling teams from conferences 10 on down it is literally impossible for you to get a number 1 seed. That, i can't agree with.

reasonable minds can differ.

[iowanjay]

I agree with Randy although, I don't think it is obvious or what WSU did last year matters. Roughly 3000 D1 teams have tried to finish the regular season undefeated since St. Joseph and none of them have. That includes many teams with weak schedules. I conclude from this that is damn difficult. Lastly, I could care less how tough a team's schedule is. Hypothetically, if you schedule a good team and you are down to that team by, lets say, 40 points at home, well I think the Shockers wouldn't do much worse.

[Jays26]

I agree with Randy although, I don't think it is obvious or what WSU did last year matters. Roughly 3000 D1 teams have tried to finish the regular season undefeated since St. Joseph and none of them have. That includes many teams with weak schedules. I conclude from this that is damn difficult. Lastly, I could care less how tough a team's schedule is. Hypothetically, if you schedule a good team and you are down to that team by, lets say, 40 points at home, well I think the Shockers wouldn't do much worse.

"head scratch"

[HoosierPal]

http://msn.foxsports.com/college-basketball/story/reid-forgrave-what-i-learned-going-behind-scenes-seeds-mock-ncaa-tournament-021714

Interesting article from Fox Sports on last week's mock bracket drill by the NCAA. Also, here is what he says about Wichita State.

"- People are going to argue against Wichita State being a 1-seed, even if the Shockers make it to the NCAA tournament undefeated. Those people are wrong. As longtime Sporting News college basketball writer Mike DeCourcy put it, "You can't fake undefeated." He's right. As of now the Shockers are absolutely a 1-seed. You can't hold it against them for trying to schedule a difficult nonconference schedule, then having a few of those nonconference opponents underperform."

[whiteandblue77]

Yes for sure they deserve a number 1 seed. If you disagree show me your three ahead of them (Cuse is of course deserving of a No. 1) and defend all of them against the Shockers. Good luck.

[handdownmandown]

I can't wait until they get their asses beat. The sooner the better. Had we stuck around, they'd have been the second best team in their conference.

That is all.

[chicagojayfan]

People shouldn't underestimate Wichita - they play pressure D are physical all over the floor and scrap on the boards. They are as tough and physical as ANYONE in the country. Their problem this year is going to be the lack of serious competition in the Valley to prepare them for tournament play. In the past, the valley was usually 8th or 9th ranked and was up to 6th one year when they had a lot of bids. Now that Creighton is no longer in the conference, I have to wonder if they will be ready for the intensity of NCAA tournament play.

As for whether or not you can put them above the others in the top 10, I think there are two ways to look at it -- 1) how many of those teams ran to the final 4 last year and took the eventual champs deep into the game? ... and 2) if the other teams are so confident that they are better, why don't they schedule a home and away with Wichita... (yeah, that's never going to happen).

But like I said, the valley isn't good at all this year and I think it will hurt them in the NCAA's due to their lack of games where the chips are down and they have to figure out ways to win

[Bill Marsh]

Yes for sure they deserve a number 1 seed. If you disagree show me your three ahead of them (Cuse is of course deserving of a No. 1) and defend all of them against the Shockers. Good luck.

I think I did precisely that in my post earlier in this thread. Why don't you respond to it and defend the shockers against the teams I listed. Specifically, what has Wichita state done in terms of positive accomplishments to earn a #1 seed that matches any of those I have listed?

[Bill Marsh]

actually, if they were the last #1 seed, they wouldn't be automatically matched up with the #5 team. The S curve is only done at the #1 seed. It's not automatic that it's in the regional finals 1/8, 2/7, 3/6, and 4/5.

just look last year
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_NCAA_ ... Tournament

1 Louisville vs 6 Duke
4 Gonzaga vs 8 Ohio St
2 Kansas vs 7 Georgetown
3 Indiana vs 5 Miami

As to your list of 5- I'm sorry, but Villanova isn't even remotely close to the #1 line. I think right now it'd be likely Syracuse, Arizona, Florida, and then it's between Kansas and Wichita. Nova right now is likely a 3. Creighton likely ahead of them quite frankly.

It's not automatic because another team might prove themselves better in the court. But in so doing, they become the de facto #5 team.

You have your opinion, Steve, that Villanova is "not remotely close to the #1 line", bit RPI Forecast disagrees with you. The fact that there might be disagreement is precisely why I listed more than 4 teams. So, instead of nitpicking over whether Villanova belongs, make a case for why WSU does. That's the topic, not Nova.

IMO, Wichita State isn't remotely close to meeting the standard for a #1 seed that the committee has consistently held up for evaluating all teams. They would be a joke as a #1 seed. If they are given a #1 seed, it would be a sure sign that the committee has no backbone and is simply caving to public pressure.