Big East Conference Expansion Ideas and Discussion

[Xudash]

Except they're not. They've won 1 NCAA game in 20 years. X has something like 18 wins in that same time period. X has a superior program and any dayton fan with a brain would acknowledge that even though they don't like X at all. It's fairly simple.

OK, I'm a fan of both Dayton and Xavier, except I'm beginning to think Xavier fans are more obnoxious.

X has played 44 NCAA tourney games and won 47% of them
Dayton has played 30 NCAA tourney games and won 46% of them

Granted a 50% bump for X, but same winning % for both. Same zip code if you ask me.

You appear to be pursuing a reputation for being obnoxious, and I certainly doubt you're a fan of Xavier. If you want to support Dayton's inclusion for your reasons, then fine, but don't waste our time with stupid comparisons.

Besides, Butler isn't exactly looking like a great addition at this point. Why do you want to go down a program comparison road that could end up focusing on Butler's program deficiencies?

[Ball Turret Gunner]

I'm a UD fan, but fairly neutral on what happens with our conference affiliation over the next 5 years. I'm honestly not sure which path is best for our program. The A10 still looks like it is going to be good. Some teams are inevitably going to be stuck as mediocre, middle of the pack New Big East teams, and I'm not so sure that is a recipe for NCAA inclusion.

I do get a kick out of X fans who make the argument that UD is so undeserving and then bring up Richmond as if they are deserving in comparison. So silly.

[XBand15]

Since numbers appear to be the name of the game, let's take a look at the 3 new programs added and the 4 expansion candidates and their all-time NCAA performance. Just for fun. (If I got any data wrong, correct me please).

Creighton: 3 Sweet 16's, 18 NCAA appearance's
Butler: 2 FF's, 2 EE's, 5 Sweet 16's, 11 NCAA appearance's
Xavier: 2 EE's, 6 Sweet 16's, 23 NCAA appearance's

Dayton: 1 FF, 2 EE's, 3 Sweet 16's, 15 NCAA appearance's
Richmond: 2 Sweet 16's, 9 NCAA appearance's
SLU: 1 EE, 2 Sweet 16's, 8 NCAA appearance's
VCU 1 FF, 1 EE, 1 Sweet 16, 12 NCAA appearance's

Just some data to consider. I realize this is just a tournament history, some things such as Dayton's final four which happened in 1967 seems a little outdated but it still happened. Its no more outdated than Providence or Depaul going to final four which also happened before I was born. This is no means pointed at attacking any fan base just me throwing out more numbers to be debated while we were at it.

[Westbrook36]

I get a kick out of fans from schools in the A-10 saying they don't need or care about the BE, ok, then why are you here? Fact of the matter is any team in the A-10 couldn't pack up and move fast enough if we extended an invite. Middle of the pack in the A-10 is an NIT invite, if your lucky, middle of the pack in the Big East equals bubble team, fact. Big difference.

All of the top teams in the A-10 want in the BE, their problem is there is no must have team in that conference. No team is a slam dunk or no brainer decision. Some like St. Louis and VCU are interesting and would be a solid additions, but they still have some questions about their candidacy.

[BillikensWin]

I get a kick out of fans from schools in the A-10 saying they don't need or care about the BE, ok, then why are you here? Fact of the matter is any team in the A-10 couldn't pack up and move fast enough if we extended an invite. Middle of the pack in the A-10 is an NIT invite, if your lucky, middle of the pack in the Big East equals bubble team, fact. Big difference.

All of the top teams in the A-10 want in the BE, their problem is there is no must have team in that conference. No team is a slam dunk or no brainer decision. Some like St. Louis and VCU are interesting and would be a solid additions, but they still have some questions about their candidacy.

The Big East is a better conference. That said, do you really think people are going to say everything sucks?

[Xudash]

I'm a UD fan, but fairly neutral on what happens with our conference affiliation over the next 5 years. I'm honestly not sure which path is best for our program. The A10 still looks like it is going to be good. Some teams are inevitably going to be stuck as mediocre, middle of the pack New Big East teams, and I'm not so sure that is a recipe for NCAA inclusion.

I do get a kick out of X fans who make the argument that UD is so undeserving and then bring up Richmond as if they are deserving in comparison. So silly.

To the extent Richmond would be considered, it could make the deciding cut because it would bring east/west balance (once a midwestern school is added), as well as a Virginia media market. Absent a fantastic tournament resume, it is a great school that just invested in a nice remodeling job for the Robbins Center, and it otherwise emphasizes basketball. There is nothing silly about any of that, including the fact that Richmond has enjoyed more recent tournament success than Dayton.

What is silly is a UD fan pretending to be neutral over UD's conference affiliation. UD never had a shot at an initial Big East invite. Yet some of your delusional colleagues were certain that UD would be included in the Big East. Nonetheless, I do have to give you guys credit. Never have so many been so proud over so little.

Otherwise, the best path for UD is to remain in the A10 to see if it can break its cycle of .500 performances in conference play, now that Xavier, Temple and Butler have cleared out of that conference. That's the best path for a program like UD. You'll benefit because you're neutral about it.

[Westbrook36]

I get a kick out of fans from schools in the A-10 saying they don't need or care about the BE, ok, then why are you here? Fact of the matter is any team in the A-10 couldn't pack up and move fast enough if we extended an invite. Middle of the pack in the A-10 is an NIT invite, if your lucky, middle of the pack in the Big East equals bubble team, fact. Big difference.

All of the top teams in the A-10 want in the BE, their problem is there is no must have team in that conference. No team is a slam dunk or no brainer decision. Some like St. Louis and VCU are interesting and would be a solid additions, but they still have some questions about their candidacy.

The Big East is a better conference. That said, do you really think people are going to say everything sucks?

Well my post wasn't intended for you or St. Louis fans in general, you and Billiken fans have been pretty good posters around here. I was just pointing out to some thickheaded A-10 fans that there's a reason this thread is now 58 pages long. They rag on the BE, but they would snap up a BE invite in a second as well as a piece of the hand that offered that invite.

[marquette]

Nonetheless, I do have to give you guys credit. Never have so many been so proud over so little.

This deserves some recognition.

[notkirkcameron]

Expansion Blind Resume time
Team A: Made a Sweet 16 appearance 3 years ago, but hasn't made it back to the tournament since. Over the past 25 years, this team has made 6 NCAA appearances and won 2 regular season conference championships and 4 conference tournament championships in a mid-major basketball league with no FBS football within the Big East's geographic footprint. Traveling students/fans can reach two other Big East cities in approximately a 4 hour drive, fostering new rivalries. The school's largest/nearest major media market: #57. On average, this school drew less than 6,000 fans to home games last season.

Team B: Made a Sweet 16 appearance 4 years ago, but hasn't made it back to the tournament since. Over the past 25 years, this team has made 6 NCAA appearances and won 2 regular season conference championships and 4 conference tournament championships in a mid-major basketball league with no FBS football within the Big East's geographic footprint. Traveling students/fans can reach two other Big East cities in approximately a 4 hour drive, fostering new rivalries. The school's largest/nearest major media market: #72. On average, this school drew less than 6,000 fans to home games last season.


Seem pretty similar, no?





Team A is Richmond.
Team B is Northern Iowa.

[NJRedman]

This is for those who say we need to add those who can compete for a league title right away. If we add two teams who can legitimately compete for the league title then two current teams vying for that title will drop. Someone has to lose every time a game is played. You don't just add to the top, there are consequences.

Once again for those who don't know. You don't add teams who are only valuable when winning. You invite teams who bring value even when they are down. You do that because at some point every team in the conference will be down, and when they are they need to still be able to help the conference make money, they cannot be an albatross around the neck of the league.

All of the X fans bitching about Dayton are actually helping the Flyers cause. They are so bad yet making a bunch of money and putting a ton of fans in the seats. Thats what presidents look for. DePaul might be a bottom feeder but to our TV partners they get the Chicago TV market.

If you add a team to the top, then someone already there will be pushed down, it's that simple. It's about adding those who have value and i'm sorry but Dayton has value. Is it more value than VCU when that program falters? Thats the million dollar question.