VCU in the BE may be a dead issue

[marq6670]

If those of you who believe that the BE will remain a 10 team conference could hold your fire for the sake of discussion, I suggest that VCU and,for that matter, all other state schools will not be invited in any expansion plans. John O'Connor, sports writer for the Richmond Times Dispatch, wrote last year that he did not think VCU would get an invite to join the newly formed BE but was not clear on his reasoning so I emailed him and received a reply. Unfortunately, I deleted the email but here's the gist of it: The administration and many other upper echelon officials would rather stay a bball only power but political pressures from Virginia are pushing for football (and eventually D1 at that!). He believes that football will come in a matter of time. He also said the previous AD resigned in large part due to the administration's opposition to FB. O'Connor said the biggest holdup seems to be lack of space for a stadium since VCU is in the middle of Richmond. However, having lived in Richmond for 20 years, I witnessed VCU getting whatever property they wanted during their phenomenal expansion. Nearby neighbors live in fear of seeing their homes bulldozed. I think the politicians want FB because despite Richmond's constant efforts to become a sports city, VCU is the only Big Kahuna in town. I think that sports writers have very good connections/sources so I take O'Connor's comments seriously.

As further evidence of state schools being subjected to political pressure (largely through gubernatorial appointments to boards) U. of Virginia's new president was ousted last year after only one year in office due to a scheming, politically appointed board member but the decision was reversed after massive public outrage. Notice how Marquette's president was ousted after a short stint without any real explanation other than that he had other plans for his "apostolic mission". AD Larry Williams also quietly left. If Marquette was a public institution the stories would be all over the news. Think this is only a Virginia issue? Did you notice during the old BE's unraveling that within a few days of UCONN's Chancellor publicly courting the ACC, Connecticut's governor chimed in and publicly stated that it would be great if UCONN was invited by the ACC? Who is calling the shots at UCONN? I believe this is why the BE presidents will not invite state schools. A deal is never a deal. There is always the unknown political element lurking in the shadows.

[GoldenBat]

Interesting. But I don't think that Fr. Pilarz (the Marquette president you spoke about) was ousted for anything related to sports. In fact, I don't think there is any evidence that he was ousted at all. For all anybody knows, he left on his own accord. Larry Williams, the AD, I'm also not sure he was ousted. Though I do think that is more likely given the departure of Pilarz. Fr. Pilarz was well-liked in the majority of the school.

[marquette]

Interesting. But I don't think that Fr. Pilarz (the Marquette president you spoke about) was ousted for anything related to sports. In fact, I don't think there is any evidence that he was ousted at all. For all anybody knows, he left on his own accord. Larry Williams, the AD, I'm also not sure he was ousted. Though I do think that is more likely given the departure of Pilarz. Fr. Pilarz was well-liked in the majority of the school.

I don't have any insider knowledge, but there was some talk that he wasn't living up to fundraising expectations. Interestingly, within 3 months of Wild coming back as president the university received an anonymous $10 million gift. Could just be coincidental.

To the topic at hand; I think those concerns may have been the reason we stopped at 10. SLU is 11. VCU is a no brainer at 12 from a basketball standpoint (barring UConn becoming available). It isn't very close between them and the other potential programs. The problem is they come with political strings, FOIA strings, institutional fit issues, and football fears (founded or not). I think an elite 8 or sweet 16 helps alleviate those concerns somewhat. A national championship or another final four eliminates them altogether.

[senditinjerome]

The city of Richmond is currently proposing building a new minor league baseball stadium in heart of the downtown area...

http://www.nbc12.com/story/23932311/ric ... ll-stadium

Richmond's current baseball stadium (the Diamond) isn't really anywhere near the downtown area, was built in the mid-1980s, is way to big, and pretty much obsolete. If this plan comes to fruition, there has been talk that VCU could acquire the Diamond, bulldoze it and build their new FB stadium on that land. VCU's Sports Backers Stadium (home to soccer and track teams) is located next to the Diamond.

[Bill Marsh]

If those of you who believe that the BE will remain a 10 team conference could hold your fire for the sake of discussion, I suggest that VCU and,for that matter, all other state schools will not be invited in any expansion plans. John O'Connor, sports writer for the Richmond Times Dispatch, wrote last year that he did not think VCU would get an invite to join the newly formed BE but was not clear on his reasoning so I emailed him and received a reply. Unfortunately, I deleted the email but here's the gist of it: The administration and many other upper echelon officials would rather stay a bball only power but political pressures from Virginia are pushing for football (and eventually D1 at that!). He believes that football will come in a matter of time. He also said the previous AD resigned in large part due to the administration's opposition to FB. O'Connor said the biggest holdup seems to be lack of space for a stadium since VCU is in the middle of Richmond. However, having lived in Richmond for 20 years, I witnessed VCU getting whatever property they wanted during their phenomenal expansion. Nearby neighbors live in fear of seeing their homes bulldozed. I think the politicians want FB because despite Richmond's constant efforts to become a sports city, VCU is the only Big Kahuna in town. I think that sports writers have very good connections/sources so I take O'Connor's comments seriously.

As further evidence of state schools being subjected to political pressure (largely through gubernatorial appointments to boards) U. of Virginia's new president was ousted last year after only one year in office due to a scheming, politically appointed board member but the decision was reversed after massive public outrage. Notice how Marquette's president was ousted after a short stint without any real explanation other than that he had other plans for his "apostolic mission". AD Larry Williams also quietly left. If Marquette was a public institution the stories would be all over the news. Think this is only a Virginia issue? Did you notice during the old BE's unraveling that within a few days of UCONN's Chancellor publicly courting the ACC, Connecticut's governor chimed in and publicly stated that it would be great if UCONN was invited by the ACC? Who is calling the shots at UCONN? I believe this is why the BE presidents will not invite state schools. A deal is never a deal. There is always the unknown political element lurking in the shadows.

It all makes a lot of sense. I live outside of Hartford, which like Richmond is the state capitol. For that reason alone, it gets more attention than any other comparably sized city in the state. I expect that the politics in Richmond are the same. A state university is an easy pawn because the state owns It and calls all the shots.

Apparently Fox wants more teams. If a public university is off the table, that's a real problem because there really is no viable option among private schools on the East Coast. To remain a power conference, I believe that the conference needs to have an Eastern identity. I don't see a good solution.

[Natty]

If those of you who believe that the BE will remain a 10 team conference could hold your fire for the sake of discussion, I suggest that VCU and,for that matter, all other state schools will not be invited in any expansion plans. John O'Connor, sports writer for the Richmond Times Dispatch, wrote last year that he did not think VCU would get an invite to join the newly formed BE but was not clear on his reasoning so I emailed him and received a reply. Unfortunately, I deleted the email but here's the gist of it: The administration and many other upper echelon officials would rather stay a bball only power but political pressures from Virginia are pushing for football (and eventually D1 at that!). He believes that football will come in a matter of time. He also said the previous AD resigned in large part due to the administration's opposition to FB. O'Connor said the biggest holdup seems to be lack of space for a stadium since VCU is in the middle of Richmond. However, having lived in Richmond for 20 years, I witnessed VCU getting whatever property they wanted during their phenomenal expansion. Nearby neighbors live in fear of seeing their homes bulldozed. I think the politicians want FB because despite Richmond's constant efforts to become a sports city, VCU is the only Big Kahuna in town. I think that sports writers have very good connections/sources so I take O'Connor's comments seriously.

With all due respect, this is a load of garbage. First, O'Connor doesn't know squat about VCU, he's the University of Richmond beat reporter who really only covers the Rams when they play UofR (I've seen him at ONE VCU game or press conference this year...guess which one). You also just said that the "previous AD resigned in large part due to the administration's opposition to FB", yet this post is about how VCU is going to get football? You think the state of VA in a cash-strapped economy is going to FORCE VCU to start football? And in an era where the BCS conferences are in open discussions of locking everyone out? GET OUT'A HERE!

Some VCU fans might want football, and pre-Shaka/Final 4 era there was certainly more of a push toward wanting it, but times have changed, and rapidly at that. I can assure you VCU wants in the Big East and has no plans on starting football and I will put my knowledge and sources of all things VCU up against O'Connors any day of the week.

[Natty]

The city of Richmond is currently proposing building a new minor league baseball stadium in heart of the downtown area...

http://www.nbc12.com/story/23932311/ric ... ll-stadium

Richmond's current baseball stadium (the Diamond) isn't really anywhere near the downtown area, was built in the mid-1980s, is way to big, and pretty much obsolete. If this plan comes to fruition, there has been talk that VCU could acquire the Diamond, bulldoze it and build their new FB stadium on that land. VCU's Sports Backers Stadium (home to soccer and track teams) is located next to the Diamond.

Total BS. There have been no plans to turn that into a football stadium for VCU. The City of Richmond owns the property after purchasing it from the RMA and virtually all of the discussion has been in developing that land into apartments, big box stores, etc.

[NJRedman]

If those of you who believe that the BE will remain a 10 team conference could hold your fire for the sake of discussion, I suggest that VCU and,for that matter, all other state schools will not be invited in any expansion plans. John O'Connor, sports writer for the Richmond Times Dispatch, wrote last year that he did not think VCU would get an invite to join the newly formed BE but was not clear on his reasoning so I emailed him and received a reply. Unfortunately, I deleted the email but here's the gist of it: The administration and many other upper echelon officials would rather stay a bball only power but political pressures from Virginia are pushing for football (and eventually D1 at that!). He believes that football will come in a matter of time. He also said the previous AD resigned in large part due to the administration's opposition to FB. O'Connor said the biggest holdup seems to be lack of space for a stadium since VCU is in the middle of Richmond. However, having lived in Richmond for 20 years, I witnessed VCU getting whatever property they wanted during their phenomenal expansion. Nearby neighbors live in fear of seeing their homes bulldozed. I think the politicians want FB because despite Richmond's constant efforts to become a sports city, VCU is the only Big Kahuna in town. I think that sports writers have very good connections/sources so I take O'Connor's comments seriously.

With all due respect, this is a load of garbage. First, O'Connor doesn't know squat about VCU, he's the University of Richmond beat reporter who really only covers the Rams when they play UofR (I've seen him at ONE VCU game or press conference this year...guess which one). You also just said that the "previous AD resigned in large part due to the administration's opposition to FB", yet this post is about how VCU is going to get football? You think the state of VA in a cash-strapped economy is going to FORCE VCU to start football? And in an era where the BCS conferences are in open discussions of locking everyone out? GET OUT'A HERE!

Some VCU fans might want football, and pre-Shaka/Final 4 era there was certainly more of a push toward wanting it, but times have changed, and rapidly at that. I can assure you VCU wants in the Big East and has no plans on starting football and I will put my knowledge and sources of all things VCU up against O'Connors any day of the week.

I agree, this makes no sense at all. Anyone with half a brain who follows whats going on in college sports knows that the current Big East with no FB programs are making more TV money than those with greater BBall pedigree like UConn who is stuck with FB in the AAC. Spending more money while making less is not that great of an idea. Also if some like the AAC wanted a team in VA they can go with ODU who already has a team and is already okayed and slated to start playing FBS FB. I know UConn and Umass are kicking themselves over upgrading their programs. UConn much rather be in the current Big East than the AAC.

If UConn never upgraded FB we'd already be at 12 teams.

Oh and it's also funny how the OP, who just signed up mind you, accidentally deleted said email. This whole thread smells like BS to me.

[marq6670]

Natty, my basic points are:

State schools are just that- state. Their owners have a big say on the decisions, including sports and conference affiliation.

VCU will have FB if the politicians want them to have it. Was Connecticut not "cash-strapped" when the decision was made to venture into FB?

VCU has been a phenomenal success in growth- facilities, academics, basketball, student population- and this inevitably inspires the universitiy's masters to want more.

Also, how could a cash-strapped newspaper afford a sports reporter who covers only little University of Richmond? How could your sources be superior to his?

I should have noted that IF VCU builds a stadium, it will almost certainly be on land currently zoned commercial. I cannot see them taking residential property for a non-academic building. In addition to the areas mentioned, Scotts Addition has many old wharehouses and there is also Manchester.

Bottom line- yes, FB may well be in VCU's future whether or not they want it. A deal with the Big East could always be trumped by Virginia. Despite VCU's great bball resume' they would be a flight risk, as would UCONN, Cincy, etc. After the BE debacle, I doubt that the presidents are willing to take a chance on a repeat performance.

[Bill Marsh]

Natty, my basic points are:

State schools are just that- state. Their owners have a big say on the decisions, including sports and conference affiliation.

VCU will have FB if the politicians want them to have it. Was Connecticut not "cash-strapped" when the decision was made to venture into FB?

VCU has been a phenomenal success in growth- facilities, academics, basketball, student population- and this inevitably inspires the universitiy's masters to want more.

Also, how could a cash-strapped newspaper afford a sports reporter who covers only little University of Richmond? How could your sources be superior to his?

I should have noted that IF VCU builds a stadium, it will almost certainly be on land currently zoned commercial. I cannot see them taking residential property for a non-academic building. In addition to the areas mentioned, Scotts Addition has many old wharehouses and there is also Manchester.

Bottom line- yes, FB may well be in VCU's future whether or not they want it. A deal with the Big East could always be trumped by Virginia. Despite VCU's great bball resume' they would be a flight risk, as would UCONN, Cincy, etc. After the BE debacle, I doubt that the presidents are willing to take a chance on a repeat performance.

Before making any assumptions here, stop for a minute and contemplate the UConn comparison for a minute

1. UConn made the move to football to protect their basketball program by getting into a BCS conference. With realignment, schools like UConn are now on the outside looking in and with power conference access appearing to be tougher than ever.
2. At the time it made its decision, UConn had a guarantee for membership in a BCS conference. VCU has no such guarantee.
3. It took UConn a dozen years from concept to BCS competition. VCU may be worth adding even if it means they'll be gone in 10-12 years. More likely a lot more. The conference upgrades now with VCU and then replaces VCU down the road with someone in the East who is more ready to step up than anyone is right now.

If VCU is unacceptable due to issues of FOI and institutional fit, that's one thing. But if the concerns are about football, that's not a good reason.