Sat 1/25 BE Game Thread (5 Games).

[Westbrook36]

So we whip Providence by 30, beat the uber talented(according to their fans) St. John's @ MSG, beat Marquette in Milwaukee for their first conference loss at home in 20 games, but we don't meet the "eye test"? And that's not even counting our OOC wins against Kansas and Iowa as well as our annual ass kicking of the Big5. May I suggest you get glasses?

If Nova is massively overrated as you jokers claim, what's that make the rest of this league? Cause last time I checked we're 6-1 and 17-2 overall. Overrate that.

[HoosierPal]

Sooo, do you think the Horizon League will take us back?

[Jet915]

Shot of record crowd of 18,889 fans.

[dmac80]

Shot of record crowd of 18,889 fans.

That's fantastic. Great for the conference. I hope they keep it up after Doug leaves.

[dmac80]

So we whip Providence by 30, beat the uber talented(according to their fans) St. John's @ MSG, beat Marquette in Milwaukee for their first conference loss at home in 20 games, but we don't meet the "eye test"? And that's not even counting our OOC wins against Kansas and Iowa as well as our annual ass kicking of the Big5. May I suggest you get glasses?

If Nova is massively overrated as you jokers claim, what's that make the rest of this league? Cause last time I checked we're 6-1 and 17-2 overall. Overrate that.

Youre not massively overrated. You might be a little overrated. Obviously fans will wonder when you lose by 30 at home. Now obviously Creighton isn't 30 points better than you just like you're not 30 better than PC. Can't wait for rematch in Providence btw. But you guys are definitely good, just not sure you're going to the final 4 yet. Still waiting to see how things continue to unfold.

[Bill Marsh]

. Nova's saving grace is getting 30-40 FT's every game seemingly. Don't know any other team in the Big East that gets that. In games where there aren't whistles every 5 secs and they are allowed to play Nova is in trouble.

This is a fact that's easily checked. You should have done that.

1. Nova doesn't average 30-40 FTs every game. They average 27.
2. I'll tell you who else does that. Seton Hall leads the Big East with 28 FTs per game.
3. Xavier and DePaul are right behind Villanova, each with 25 per game. Georgetown & Matquette each average 24. SJU, PC, & Buttler are bunched up right behind them with 23
4. It seems to me that most teams in the conference are bunched up in a pretty narrow range of 23-28.
5. Getting to the line is a skill. A team doesn't deserve to be criticized for doing a god job with that skill.
6. The team that's an anomaly is Creighton, who averages only 19. The reason for that is because they don't take the ball to the hole. That's not a good thing. It's something that could come back to haunt them before the season is over.

[Jays 4 3]

. Nova's saving grace is getting 30-40 FT's every game seemingly. Don't know any other team in the Big East that gets that. In games where there aren't whistles every 5 secs and they are allowed to play Nova is in trouble.

This is a fact that's easily checked. You should have done that.

1. Nova doesn't average 30-40 FTs every game. They average 27.
2. I'll tell you who else does that. Seton Hall leads the Big East with 28 FTs per game.
3. Xavier and DePaul are right behind Villanova, each with 25 per game. Georgetown & Matquette each average 24. SJU, PC, & Buttler are bunched up right behind them with 23
4. It seems to me that most teams in the conference are bunched up in a pretty narrow range of 23-28.
5. Getting to the line is a skill. A team doesn't deserve to be criticized for doing a god job with that skill.
6. The team that's an anomaly is Creighton, who averages only 19. The reason for that is because they don't take the ball to the hole. That's not a good thing. It's something that could come back to haunt them before the season is over.

Re #6. It may haunt them I guess, however when you are the most efficient offense (and probably best shooting) team in the country you roll with what you have. Why would a bunch of guys who are better than 40% career three point shooters start driving when it is not their strength at all just to try and take more free throws?

[handdownmandown]

It's also overrated because very few of our games have been close enough to have the other team try to foul at the end to catch up. A ton of them have just been bench players playing out the string.

Tonight when GTown was fouling I told my wife the only other time that comes to mind where the opposition was sending us to the line at the end of the game was the one at the C-Link vs X. Other than that, not much.

[Xudash]

Sooo, do you think the Horizon League will take us back?

Serious answer: of course they would; Butler was their flagship program.

We both know that isn't happening, and we all know you meant that in jest.

However, my concern for Butler moving forward is how it progresses from here in the Big East. Butler has a solid track record in the Tournament, but most of that came from making it there by dominating the Horizon League. The Bulldogs literally pulled all that off with a little luck - as is the case with virtually every team that makes it to a F4 - and on low budgets.

Just like companies sometime grow too quickly, Butler's basketball program may be experiencing that now. People love Hinkle for its tradition while others shake their heads over how badly it needs investment, and it is limited in terms of revenue generation (i.e. no suites, etc.). Butler needs facilities improvements overall. That's one issue. Another issue is that Butler has come into the Big East with some Horizon personnel - - some, not all. And you have a new, inexperienced coach. Brad Stevens left Butler FOR the Celtics position, but he also probably clearly understood his stock was very high and that Butler was about to face these circumstances. He got out while his stock was high, going to a high brand-value franchise for a lot of money.

I still tend to believe that Butler will be a positive contributor in this conference. Of the three newcomers, especially understanding Xavier's track record, resources and recruiting pipeline, I have no doubt that Xavier will be formidable in the Big East. From what I saw tonight of the Creighton v. Georgetown game, what an addition Creighton is to this conference! I mean good lord, that game showed very well on television tonight in terms of facility and crowd support. Creighton is an excellent school and I presume McDermott is an excellent coach and recruiter, so I'll go with believing that Creighton is sustainable as well, even after its 3-point bombers leave campus.

Otherwise, the Nova's, Georgetown's, and Marquette's will keep rolling along. Providence is demonstrating that it's coming back under Cooley. Watch out when St. Johns figures out that Lavin should go back into broadcasting, assuming St. John's then makes the right hire. DePaul is another sleeping giant. And Seton Hall has its strong recruiting class coming in next year.

It's safe to say that no program has much margin for error, but that probably holds more true for Butler than any other Big East program at this point, given your positioning upon entering the conference.

[Bill Marsh]

It wasn't just the Creighton game…Nova barely escaped SJ, Butler among others. Don't get too cocky because this league humbles you quickly. Just ask G'Town and Marquette who were supposed to be ranked teams. Nova was not even ranked in the preseason. You go 3-0 in OT games, squeak out a few others and you aren't thankful? This year's Nova team is good but they are not world beaters. In fact I think they'd lose to Duke, Michigan, Wisconsin, UK, Michigan State, PITT, etc. all of whom are ranked substantially worse. This is not any kind of rip on Nova because those are all very good teams and obviously Nova is one themselves. I just don't get the feeling they are juggernauts. I get the feeling they got a few key wins early to get a high ranking, and they won every close game including 3 OT's. Only loss vs. Cuse. I would love for Nova to prove me wrong but I still see them as a 15-20 type team. Every team has flaws in this conference. It's important to remember that Nova was unranked…you guys should be very humble going from unranked to #4. I just get the sense that the team has peaked. You can disagree…just my opinion.

You would have included Kansas on your list of teams whom you believe would beat Nova, but you can't because Nova beat them. And Iowa.and everyone from this league that humbles you quickly except Creighton. In fact they blew out PC by 30, the same team that spanked Creighton just a couple of days before they beat Villanova.

Your comment about Nova not being ranked preseason is absurd. It just means that the "experts" who do the rankings were wrong. Who are you going to believe? The experts or your lyin'' eyes?

Following your logic, Arizona doesn't deserve to be ranked #1 because they almost lost to Michigan, and they almost lost to UNLV, and they almost lost to Duke. Heck, they barely got by Drexel!

Ignore the fact that Syracuse is undefeated. Didn't they almost lose to Pitt, and Miami, and St. John's. They barely got by that St. Francis powerhouse from Brooklyn despite having home court advantage!

Michigan State just suffered their 2nd loss. Could have seen that coming, right? After all 2 of their earlier wins came in OT, so they must be overrated. Not to mention that they almost lost to Indiana and Kenrucky AND Oakland! Who's Oakland?

You can play this same game with any team in the country. What matters is what Cillanova has achieved, not how good anyone thinks they are. What they have achieved deservedly has them ranked in the top 10. Only if their achievements fall off will they drop. This is a results oriented business. And so far Villanova has gotten results.