Tues 12/17 BE Game Thread (4 Games).

[Bill Marsh]

Cincinnati's win over Pitt is great for Xavier and the Big East.

Great for Xavier, not sure about the Big East. Cincy will be a bubble team that teams like St John's will be fighting for spot to the tourney. Them winning doesn't help that at all....

But it does increase the value of the Xavier win and that translates into a stronger power rating for Xavier. A higher ranked Xavier means stronger SOS for the entire conference and it makes every win that a Big East school gets over Xavier a higher quality win. So, it does help the conference.

As for Cincy being a bubble team, we simply don't know that yet. They have played only 4 teams that are any good and they are 2-2 in those 4 games with one of those wins being a squeaker and one of those losses being a blow out. The rest of their schedule is a bunch of cup cakes. In fact to call them cup cakes is an insult to cup cakes.

Their schedule is a real problem for Cincinnati. The AAC is so weak below the top teams that there is little opportunity for quality wins unless they can beat the cream of the conference. I don't see this Cincinnati team as being capable of beating Louisville, UConn, or Memphis. So, when the committee looks at their resume, what's it going to show. So far it's wins over NC State and Pitt. My hunch is that it's not going to show much else. Because I anticipate that they will have a paucity of quality wins, I really don't see them as a tournament team.

[stever20]

Cincinnati's win over Pitt is great for Xavier and the Big East.

Great for Xavier, not sure about the Big East. Cincy will be a bubble team that teams like St John's will be fighting for spot to the tourney. Them winning doesn't help that at all....

But it does increase the value of the Xavier win and that translates into a stronger power rating for Xavier. A higher ranked Xavier means stronger SOS for the entire conference and it makes every win that a Big East school gets over Xavier a higher quality win. So, it does help the conference.

As for Cincy being a bubble team, we simply don't know that yet. They have played only 4 teams that are any good and they are 2-2 in those 4 games with one of those wins being a squeaker and one of those losses being a blow out. The rest of their schedule is a bunch of cup cakes. In fact to call them cup cakes is an insult to cup cakes.

Their schedule is a real problem for Cincinnati. The AAC is so weak below the top teams that there is little opportunity for quality wins unless they can beat the cream of the conference. I don't see this Cincinnati team as being capable of beating Louisville, UConn, or Memphis. So, when the committee looks at their resume, what's it going to show. So far it's wins over NC State and Pitt. My hunch is that it's not going to show much else. Because I anticipate that they will have a paucity of quality wins, I really don't see them as a tournament team.

The thing is, Cincy will have 6 chances to play those teams- 3 at home. That's huge. If they sweep vs Houston, Rutgers, Temple, USF, UCF- that's 10 wins there. If they can go 2-6 vs the others(to include SMU), they are 12-6 in conference and 23-8 overall. That's a lot of wins to get left out quite frankly.

[XUFan09]

PItt hasn't made a FG in 12 minutes against Cincy. And they only trail 42-39 with 2 minutes to go.

Why bother bringing basketballs to a rock fight?

They were trying to build a new arena with all those bricks.

The announcer made that joke, but his colleague didn't catch it in rhythm to properly respond lol.

[Bill Marsh]

Great for Xavier, not sure about the Big East. Cincy will be a bubble team that teams like St John's will be fighting for spot to the tourney. Them winning doesn't help that at all....

But it does increase the value of the Xavier win and that translates into a stronger power rating for Xavier. A higher ranked Xavier means stronger SOS for the entire conference and it makes every win that a Big East school gets over Xavier a higher quality win. So, it does help the conference.

As for Cincy being a bubble team, we simply don't know that yet. They have played only 4 teams that are any good and they are 2-2 in those 4 games with one of those wins being a squeaker and one of those losses being a blow out. The rest of their schedule is a bunch of cup cakes. In fact to call them cup cakes is an insult to cup cakes.

Their schedule is a real problem for Cincinnati. The AAC is so weak below the top teams that there is little opportunity for quality wins unless they can beat the cream of the conference. I don't see this Cincinnati team as being capable of beating Louisville, UConn, or Memphis. So, when the committee looks at their resume, what's it going to show. So far it's wins over NC State and Pitt. My hunch is that it's not going to show much else. Because I anticipate that they will have a paucity of quality wins, I really don't see them as a tournament team.

The thing is, Cincy will have 6 chances to play those teams- 3 at home. That's huge. If they sweep vs Houston, Rutgers, Temple, USF, UCF- that's 10 wins there. If they can go 2-6 vs the others(to include SMU), they are 12-6 in conference and 23-8 overall. That's a lot of wins to get left out quite frankly.

Steve. You know better than this. 23-8 teams get left out every year. Southern Mississippi went 25-9 last year and was left out because they didn't beat anyone that mattered. If Cincy does the same thing, they too will be left out.

[stever20]

Steve. You know better than this. 23-8 teams get left out every year. Southern Mississippi went 25-9 last year and was left out because they didn't beat anyone that mattered. If Cincy does the same thing, they too will be left out.

AAC a whole lot better league than CUSA was. Just looked at RPI forecast, if they go 22-9 even, their projected RPI is 49. 23-8 and it's in the top 40. Teams from conferences like the AAC just do not get left out of the tournament with top 40 rpi. period.

Also, Cincy has done more OOC than Southern Miss did last year. Their best OOC win was vs Denver last year. Cincy has beaten NC State and now Pitt(neutral site, which is huge).

[GumbyDamnit!]

Steve. You know better than this. 23-8 teams get left out every year. Southern Mississippi went 25-9 last year and was left out because they didn't beat anyone that mattered. If Cincy does the same thing, they too will be left out.

AAC a whole lot better league than CUSA was. Just looked at RPI forecast, if they go 22-9 even, their projected RPI is 49. 23-8 and it's in the top 40. Teams from conferences like the AAC just do not get left out of the tournament with top 40 rpi. period.

Also, Cincy has done more OOC than Southern Miss did last year. Their best OOC win was vs Denver last year. Cincy has beaten NC State and now Pitt(neutral site, which is huge).

Stever I appreciate the time you put into some of your analysis but to break down every team and make assumptions about what will be happening in March (ie - Cincy will be battling with SJU as a bubble team), seems so premature to me. Not only have you figured out where Cincy will be, based on their remaining schedule, but seem to know that SJU will be right beside them. Doesn't that seem just a bit overreaching at this point. Can't we wait a little longer until conference games begin and things start to shake out a little?

[stever20]

Steve. You know better than this. 23-8 teams get left out every year. Southern Mississippi went 25-9 last year and was left out because they didn't beat anyone that mattered. If Cincy does the same thing, they too will be left out.

AAC a whole lot better league than CUSA was. Just looked at RPI forecast, if they go 22-9 even, their projected RPI is 49. 23-8 and it's in the top 40. Teams from conferences like the AAC just do not get left out of the tournament with top 40 rpi. period.

Also, Cincy has done more OOC than Southern Miss did last year. Their best OOC win was vs Denver last year. Cincy has beaten NC State and now Pitt(neutral site, which is huge).

Stever I appreciate the time you put into some of your analysis but to break down every team and make assumptions about what will be happening in March (ie - Cincy will be battling with SJU as a bubble team), seems so premature to me. Not only have you figured out where Cincy will be, based on their remaining schedule, but seem to know that SJU will be right beside them. Doesn't that seem just a bit overreaching at this point. Can't we wait a little longer until conference games begin and things start to shake out a little?

I said a team like a St John's. You know we will have from all looks a lot of bubble teams. It may not be St John's, it may be a PC. It may be Butler.

[GumbyDamnit!]

Stever I appreciate the time you put into some of your analysis but to break down every team and make assumptions about what will be happening in March (ie - Cincy will be battling with SJU as a bubble team), seems so premature to me. Not only have you figured out where Cincy will be, based on their remaining schedule, but seem to know that SJU will be right beside them. Doesn't that seem just a bit overreaching at this point. Can't we wait a little longer until conference games begin and things start to shake out a little?

I said a team like a St John's. You know we will have from all looks a lot of bubble teams. It may not be St John's, it may be a PC. It may be Butler.

Exactly it MIGHT be SJU, or Butler, PC or even Xavier. And on the other side it MIGHT be Cincy, or SMU, Temple, Pitt, ND, Penn State, Tenn. or anyone. That's my point. There are soooooo many variables and games left to be played out that for us to debate if Cincy beating Pitt is good for the BE or bad (depending on whether Xavier is a bubble team or SJU is a bubble team, and whether Pitt ad Cincy will be bubble teams or not) seems so outlandish to me. Anyone can literally argue that any of 100 different teams have the potential to be a bubble team at this point, and there are exponential matchups in conference yet to come that are all going to move the needle one way or another. You seem to already have it figured out exactly where teams are going to land based on 33% returns.

I am not saying this to be a wise ass but perhaps the Admin can give you a special area that we can call HLOH Stever's Bracketology and you can give us a snapshot of who you think the tourney field is in real time. You can be our resident Lundardi. But to dissect every result on every post in terms of tourney implications before conference play has even begun is akin to a teacher predicting everyone's final grade after 1 quiz. There is no guarantee that a student getting an A now is not going to crap his pants, and the C student still has many tests left to get that grade up. Now, after 3-4 quizzes you can start to make better assumptions. I think that is where we are right now with the college hoops season. Let's see what teams do with 1/2 of the conference schedule behind them before starting to make any tourney predictions.

[XU85]

Stever I appreciate the time you put into some of your analysis but to break down every team and make assumptions about what will be happening in March (ie - Cincy will be battling with SJU as a bubble team), seems so premature to me. Not only have you figured out where Cincy will be, based on their remaining schedule, but seem to know that SJU will be right beside them. Doesn't that seem just a bit overreaching at this point. Can't we wait a little longer until conference games begin and things start to shake out a little?

I said a team like a St John's. You know we will have from all looks a lot of bubble teams. It may not be St John's, it may be a PC. It may be Butler.

Exactly it MIGHT be SJU, or Butler, PC or even Xavier. And on the other side it MIGHT be Cincy, or SMU, Temple, Pitt, ND, Penn State, Tenn. or anyone. That's my point. There are soooooo many variables and games left to be played out that for us to debate if Cincy beating Pitt is good for the BE or bad (depending on whether Xavier is a bubble team or SJU is a bubble team, and whether Pitt ad Cincy will be bubble teams or not) seems so outlandish to me. Anyone can literally argue that any of 100 different teams have the potential to be a bubble team at this point, and there are exponential matchups in conference yet to come that are all going to move the needle one way or another. You seem to already have it figured out exactly where teams are going to land based on 33% returns.

I am not saying this to be a wise ass but perhaps the Admin can give you a special area that we can call HLOH Stever's Bracketology and you can give us a snapshot of who you think the tourney field is in real time. You can be our resident Lundardi. But to dissect every result on every post in terms of tourney implications before conference play has even begun is akin to a teacher predicting everyone's final grade after 1 quiz. There is no guarantee that a student getting an A now is not going to crap his pants, and the C student still has many tests left to get that grade up. Now, after 3-4 quizzes you can start to make better assumptions. I think that is where we are right now with the college hoops season. Let's see what teams do with 1/2 of the conference schedule behind them before starting to make any tourney predictions.

Gumby: Entertaining response, to which I agree 100%. Stever your lengthy and gloomy microanalyses are painful to read, and quite frankly have a mid major feel, something I as an X fan was hoping to escape upon joining the Big East.

[stever20]

Stever I appreciate the time you put into some of your analysis but to break down every team and make assumptions about what will be happening in March (ie - Cincy will be battling with SJU as a bubble team), seems so premature to me. Not only have you figured out where Cincy will be, based on their remaining schedule, but seem to know that SJU will be right beside them. Doesn't that seem just a bit overreaching at this point. Can't we wait a little longer until conference games begin and things start to shake out a little?

I said a team like a St John's. You know we will have from all looks a lot of bubble teams. It may not be St John's, it may be a PC. It may be Butler.

Exactly it MIGHT be SJU, or Butler, PC or even Xavier. And on the other side it MIGHT be Cincy, or SMU, Temple, Pitt, ND, Penn State, Tenn. or anyone. That's my point. There are soooooo many variables and games left to be played out that for us to debate if Cincy beating Pitt is good for the BE or bad (depending on whether Xavier is a bubble team or SJU is a bubble team, and whether Pitt ad Cincy will be bubble teams or not) seems so outlandish to me. Anyone can literally argue that any of 100 different teams have the potential to be a bubble team at this point, and there are exponential matchups in conference yet to come that are all going to move the needle one way or another. You seem to already have it figured out exactly where teams are going to land based on 33% returns.

I am not saying this to be a wise ass but perhaps the Admin can give you a special area that we can call HLOH Stever's Bracketology and you can give us a snapshot of who you think the tourney field is in real time. You can be our resident Lundardi. But to dissect every result on every post in terms of tourney implications before conference play has even begun is akin to a teacher predicting everyone's final grade after 1 quiz. There is no guarantee that a student getting an A now is not going to crap his pants, and the C student still has many tests left to get that grade up. Now, after 3-4 quizzes you can start to make better assumptions. I think that is where we are right now with the college hoops season. Let's see what teams do with 1/2 of the conference schedule behind them before starting to make any tourney predictions.

my point originally was though that Cincy by all projections is looking like a bubble team(has been since the start of the year), just like a lot of our teams project to be. Them winning a big time game isn't a good thing(just like I'd say from any other team that is looking to be a bubble team) for the Big East(outside of Xavier). To say like billyjack said that it's great for Xavier and great for the Big East is just as much of a joke. If Cincy is a bubble team, it's not great for the Big East at all that they got a big time win.