Disappointing...again.

[GumbyDamnit!]

Here’s the other thing that can’t be dismissed: when we face these “power” programs head to head and battle them toe to toe, we earn respect. Go to KU’s board and read what they think of SHU. Nothing but respect. I’m sure Jayhawk nation’s perceptions of SHU are vastly different after the game then before. I saw comments like: “how did that team lose so many BE conference games?” That solidifies perception too. When your last place team knocks of Duke on national TV, fans notice. When your 2nd place team is the #1 KPI team, yet can’t win their conference, people notice. If Nova makes another run that will only confirm what a great team X must have been to win the league outright. Do you think T A&M fans respect PC less than UNC? Think Purdue is glad not to see Butler again?

League perception is fine. In reality we’ve had one unexpected result: X v FSU. In 2 weeks or 20 years the narrative will still be about UVA v UMBC. That’s the story of the 1st weekend. All of this conference insecurity is self imposed. And if you are letting some troll (like Stever) make you think twice about this great league, then you are missing what’s going on. We have something special and a single elimination game cannot change that.

[Savannah Jay]

So, I asked myself, who is getting their teams deep into the tournament? Now I’m all in. Here are the conferences ranked by Elite 8’s per conference member with totals in parentheses, for the 12 years in question, using current membership:

1.47 - ACC (22)
1.40 - B12 (14)
1.21 - SEC (17)
0.90 - BEC (9)
0.79 - B1G (11)
0.64 - P12 (9)
0.67 - AAC (8)
0.29 - A10 (4)
0.20 - WCC (2)

Each of the top 4 conferences has produced at least 1 NC in that period with the ACC being phenomenally successful with 5. Only UConn from the rest has won a NC. In fact neither the Big Ten nor the PAC 12 has a NC since 2000. The Big East members have won 2 in that period.

The doomsday voices say that we haven’t done anything in the tournament. Well, we have. They want to focus on 2014-15 when we missed a deep tourney run. The Big Ten missed in 2016-17. So? The Big 12 missed in 2013-15. I think you get the point about small sample sizes. I think the rest of the country knows that this is a collection of schools with a proven track record, any of whom can rise up and produce a team that will make a deep tournament run. Since 1997, 7 of 10 conference members have made a run to the Elite 8. I wonder how many other conferences can say that? Let me check . . .

There you go, Bill, fighting emotions, hysteria, and anti-BE trollers with facts. The nerve.

[GumbyDamnit!]

Agree SavJay. BillM, a quality poster since Aug of 2013. He has a great sense of the history of the BE and Northeast BB on the whole. Some young buck posters could learn a thing or two from his sage posts.

[butlerguy03]

I love the Big East, but the national perception is Villanova and those other schools. You don't get that from the Football 5. As a Butler fan, that is my concern - being one of the "other." It's the casual fan who you have to swing, not most of us on a college basketball forum.

It's not doom and gloom, but it's not sunshine and rainbows either.

[gtmoBlue]

It's Always sunshine, rainbows, and lollipops!
Why let such trivial things such as public perception, trolls, and facts get in your way?

I don't!

[aughnanure]

I love the Big East, but the national perception is Villanova and those other schools. You don't get that from the Football 5. As a Butler fan, that is my concern - being one of the "other." It's the casual fan who you have to swing, not most of us on a college basketball forum.

It's not doom and gloom, but it's not sunshine and rainbows either.

Yeah, this was a bad year for Xavier to finally underachieve. They’ve consistently done well getting to the second weekend. And having two #1s, we were going to be a target if both didn’t do well (I.e. Sweet 16 game would have been acceptable for the first one to go out).

Hard to get mad at the rest, or pull out any major conclusions. 7-10 range seeds are just the death nell and unfortunately we didn’t and couldn’ benefit from the upsets like Kansas State did for the Big 12. But both Seton Hall and Butler almost made it happen.

The next step for the conference is getting 3 of our teams under the 7 seed (assuming we can keep at least 1 in and 1-2 seed). My expectation for Marquette next year is a 6 seed or better, or I will be on the Wojo out train (injuries permitting). If you can get 4 of your teams under the 7 seed, the chances of getting 3-4 in the Sweet 16, and one getting a super favorable path because of upsets, go up exponentially.

[ArmyVet]

I love the Big East, but the national perception is Villanova and those other schools. You don't get that from the Football 5. As a Butler fan, that is my concern - being one of the "other." It's the casual fan who you have to swing, not most of us on a college basketball forum.

It's not doom and gloom, but it's not sunshine and rainbows either.

That is why I think it was somewhat important to have another team win the regular season to dispel that notion.

[stever20]

I love the Big East, but the national perception is Villanova and those other schools. You don't get that from the Football 5. As a Butler fan, that is my concern - being one of the "other." It's the casual fan who you have to swing, not most of us on a college basketball forum.

It's not doom and gloom, but it's not sunshine and rainbows either.

Yeah, this was a bad year for Xavier to finally underachieve. They’ve consistently done well getting to the second weekend. And having two #1s, we were going to be a target if both didn’t do well (I.e. Sweet 16 game would have been acceptable for the first one to go out).

Hard to get mad at the rest, or pull out any major conclusions. 7-10 range seeds are just the death nell and unfortunately we didn’t and couldn’ benefit from the upsets like Kansas State did for the Big 12. But both Seton Hall and Butler almost made it happen.

The next step for the conference is getting 3 of our teams under the 7 seed (assuming we can keep at least 1 in and 1-2 seed). My expectation for Marquette next year is a 6 seed or better, or I will be on the Wojo out train (injuries permitting). If you can get 4 of your teams under the 7 seed, the chances of getting 3-4 in the Sweet 16, and one getting a super favorable path because of upsets, go up exponentially.

The problem is the chances of getting 4 in under the 7 seed are very minimal. To do it, you have to have a really good OOC schedule and do really well with it. Big 12 did it last year with 4 top 5 seeds. All 4 were at least 12-6 in conference play. Kansas lost 1 OOC Game. WVU lost 1 OOC game. Baylor was undefeated. Iowa St lost 4 times OOC, but won the conference tourney. All 4 of their OOC SOS was in the top 100. That's what it takes to get 4 top 5-6 seeds.

[Bill Marsh]

I love the Big East, but the national perception is Villanova and those other schools. You don't get that from the Football 5. As a Butler fan, that is my concern - being one of the "other." It's the casual fan who you have to swing, not most of us on a college basketball forum.

It's not doom and gloom, but it's not sunshine and rainbows either.

Actually you do get that from the Football 5. In the Big 12, it’s Kansas and those other schools. In the SEC, it’s Kentucky and those other schools. In the ACC, it’s been North Carolina + Duke and those other schools.

The reason why that’s not the case in the PAC-12 is because the conference has had so little success that there is no big dog any more. The whole conference is nothing but those other schools.

The one exception might be the Big Ten because they tend to rotate things at the top. But it’s not like their schools really have tremendous success nationally. One national championship since the 1989 title that was stolen from Seton Hall. More scandals than titles. That kind of “success” is nothing to brag about.

[scoscox]

I love the Big East, but the national perception is Villanova and those other schools. You don't get that from the Football 5. As a Butler fan, that is my concern - being one of the "other." It's the casual fan who you have to swing, not most of us on a college basketball forum.

It's not doom and gloom, but it's not sunshine and rainbows either.

Once again, this perception, if it exists isn’t a big deal. A. It makes no sense B. It’s the same in every conference, see Kansas, Kentucky, UCLA, etc.

Those other leagues don’t have programs like Georgetown and Marquette laying dormant at the bottom either.