How Hot Are Our Coaches Seats?

[billyjack]

You see, Syracuse isn't remembered anywhere near as much as Villanova is. Not even remotely close. Also, what made folks think of Syracuse was at least they made the title game in 1987.

Also, 85 Georgetown, 15 Kentucky, and 14 Florida all at least made the final 4. But they aren't remembered anywhere near as much as who won the championships. 14 Florida is remembered a whole lot better than Wichita St for example from 14 is losing in the 2nd round. And whether you like it or not, UConn who was a 7 seed in 2014 is remembered light years better than Villanova who was a 2 seed in 2014.

You might think the regular season is what matters. That's your prerogative. But It's not what the media thinks matters, and it's not what casual fans think matters.

I take Butler. What made Butler wasn't going to the tournament in 10 of 15 years or all the great regular seasons. What made Butler was going to the title game 2 straight years. 100%.

Nobody here, including you, even knows what you're arguing about. Is it winning championships?, losing title games?, making Final Fours?, being ranked high?, getting high seeds, going 62-8?, etc...? You claim that only championships are remembered, yet rattle off a half dozen teams off the top of your head that didn't win it all. Actually, please don't answer.

Oh yeah, and Syracuse was absolutely considered one of the successful faces of the Big East thru 1986. In those previous 10 years, Boeheim's first 10, they accomplished less than Villanova has under Wright but were considered a major player and national success. This is even though Boeheim never won more than 1 game in any one NCAA tourney from 1977 thru 1986... but SU was usually ranked, and had records like 26-4, 22-6, 26-4 again, 22-9, 26-6, 23-9, 22-12... this is an exact parallel situation, except SU accomplished less, and has nothing to do with 1987.

[marquette]

I'm almost positive Gumby is right.

And you are also wrong. Google is your friend.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/ ... n-in-2013/

[marquette]

I think we can all agree that Nova has done a great job of representing the league. Where the problem starts is one (maybe two) Nova fans taking things too seriously. Once the sniping begins, it tends to get out of control fast (and yes, I'm as guilty as any at this point).

At this point I am going to exit the thread. Have fun wherever it goes.

[stever20]

And nationally they were ridiculed because they never did squat in the tourney. They weren't considered a national success because they could never win in the tourney. It wasn't until 1987's final 4 that they got the respect. That validated Syracuse quite a bit. And even with Syracuse, Boeheim didn't get the full respect until 2003 when they won the title. Just like Coach K or Dean Smith.

What made Butler for instance is making the title games, not a damn thing they did in the regular season. The tourney is what folks remember, not regular seasons. Just like other sports. Here in DC the Nationals/Caps have both had a lot of great seasons. But because we choked in the playoffs- that's what is remembered 10000 times more than the regular seasons. Maybe the regular seasons should mean more- but that just isn't realistic. And it's not changing.

[stever20]

another example.....

who is remembered as being better:
Atlanta Braves- won division 14 straight years from 1991-2005. Only won 1 WS. Lost WS 4 times
New York Yankees- made playoffs 12 straight years from 1995-2007- with 3 of the times in as a wild card. Won 4 WS, and lost 2 more WS. Then after missing in 2008, won a 5th WS.

The Yankees are remembered far better.

Heck, for a lot of folks, the Marlins are remembered better than the Braves because they won 2 WS.

So, I think how you view Nova is kind of how you view sports. If you view sports as being a playoff king type of thing- Nova hasn't been good. If you view sports as being a regular season king type of thing- Nova has been excellent. Neither one is wrong, but I feel like a huge majority of folks(and maybe more importantly the media)- are playoff king type of thing.

[BuckNasty85]

I think we can all agree that Nova has done a great job of representing the league. Where the problem starts is one (maybe two) Nova fans taking things too seriously. Once the sniping begins, it tends to get out of control fast (and yes, I'm as guilty as any at this point).

At this point I am going to exit the thread. Have fun wherever it goes.

Marquette, what you need to understand is I grew up in and now again live in St. John's country. I am not talking about Manhattan where the majority of people don't know the Yankees and Mets are about to both make the playoffs. I am talking right outside Queens, where everybody knows somebody who went to St. John's, and if you didn't have another college hoops team to root for, they were the team. I might be a little quick on the trigger, but I have been dealing with this all my life, so it isn't just a message board that gets me going, it is listening to the same delusional nonsense for St. John's fans all my life.

My first post REALLY wasn't that harsh and I even somewhat apologized in the final paragraph of that initial post. But again, St. John's has had 5 different coaches in the last 15 years, I know who Chris Mullin is and his recruiting thus far has been good, good, not great, but good. The fact that Jordan and Obepka decided not to come back is probably a blessing in disguise, but it didn't lead me to believe that kids who weren't alive until 1995 are about to start bowing down to Chris Mullin, a guy that people from that age group are really not that familiar with.

I don't blame St. John's fans for having high hopes, we all do because we need all teams in the Big East to be competitive now, but haven't the last 15 years taught you anything?!?!?!?!?!?! Let's see how this thing plays out before you start saying a coach who has never coached a college game in his life is more safe in his job than a coach who just brought his team to 9 out of last 10 NCAA tournaments, not to mention an elite eight and a final four. I know how things have played out for Villanova the last few years but the fact that we are even there says A LOT more than most teams.

High hopes for Mullin, but I had every right to be like, "are you kidding me?" after the initial post and remind the poster that Mullin just took over a debacle, not Duke.

[GumbyDamnit!]

another example.....

who is remembered as being better:
Atlanta Braves- won division 14 straight years from 1991-2005. Only won 1 WS. Lost WS 4 times
New York Yankees- made playoffs 12 straight years from 1995-2007- with 3 of the times in as a wild card. Won 4 WS, and lost 2 more WS. Then after missing in 2008, won a 5th WS.

The Yankees are remembered far better.

Heck, for a lot of folks, the Marlins are remembered better than the Braves because they won 2 WS.

So, I think how you view Nova is kind of how you view sports. If you view sports as being a playoff king type of thing- Nova hasn't been good. If you view sports as being a regular season king type of thing- Nova has been excellent. Neither one is wrong, but I feel like a huge majority of folks(and maybe more importantly the media)- are playoff king type of thing.

Just when I thought I was out you pull me back in... Not going to beat a dead horse any deader by discussing Nova and how YOU (neither a fan of Nova nor the BE) feel about them.

But if you think that people hold two rent-a-player Marlin WS teams in the same regard as a team that won 14 straight division titles, then you and I will never agree. I can't name 3 players from either of those 2 Marlins WS champ teams but I will NEVER forget the Braves era that produced the Glavine--Smoltz--Madduz trio along with Chipper Jones and Bobby Cox. Consistent excellence. I'd take 14 straight div titles and a WS Championship over 12 mediocre years and 2 WS Championships any day of the week.

[NJRedman]

I think we can all agree that Nova has done a great job of representing the league. Where the problem starts is one (maybe two) Nova fans taking things too seriously. Once the sniping begins, it tends to get out of control fast (and yes, I'm as guilty as any at this point).

At this point I am going to exit the thread. Have fun wherever it goes.

Marquette, what you need to understand is I grew up in and now again live in St. John's country. I am not talking about Manhattan where the majority of people don't know the Yankees and Mets are about to both make the playoffs. I am talking right outside Queens, where everybody knows somebody who went to St. John's, and if you didn't have another college hoops team to root for, they were the team. I might be a little quick on the trigger, but I have been dealing with this all my life, so it isn't just a message board that gets me going, it is listening to the same delusional nonsense for St. John's fans all my life.

My first post REALLY wasn't that harsh and I even somewhat apologized in the final paragraph of that initial post. But again, St. John's has had 5 different coaches in the last 15 years, I know who Chris Mullin is and his recruiting thus far has been good, good, not great, but good. The fact that Jordan and Obepka decided not to come back is probably a blessing in disguise, but it didn't lead me to believe that kids who weren't alive until 1995 are about to start bowing down to Chris Mullin, a guy that people from that age group are really not that familiar with.

I don't blame St. John's fans for having high hopes, we all do because we need all teams in the Big East to be competitive now, but haven't the last 15 years taught you anything?!?!?!?!?!?! Let's see how this thing plays out before you start saying a coach who has never coached a college game in his life is more safe in his job than a coach who just brought his team to 9 out of last 10 NCAA tournaments, not to mention an elite eight and a final four. I know how things have played out for Villanova the last few years but the fact that we are even there says A LOT more than most teams.

High hopes for Mullin, but I had every right to be like, "are you kidding me?" after the initial post and remind the poster that Mullin just took over a debacle, not Duke.

Name change i see? Did you get booted for your freak outs?

[stever20]

another example.....

who is remembered as being better:
Atlanta Braves- won division 14 straight years from 1991-2005. Only won 1 WS. Lost WS 4 times
New York Yankees- made playoffs 12 straight years from 1995-2007- with 3 of the times in as a wild card. Won 4 WS, and lost 2 more WS. Then after missing in 2008, won a 5th WS.

The Yankees are remembered far better.

Heck, for a lot of folks, the Marlins are remembered better than the Braves because they won 2 WS.

So, I think how you view Nova is kind of how you view sports. If you view sports as being a playoff king type of thing- Nova hasn't been good. If you view sports as being a regular season king type of thing- Nova has been excellent. Neither one is wrong, but I feel like a huge majority of folks(and maybe more importantly the media)- are playoff king type of thing.

Just when I thought I was out you pull me back in... Not going to beat a dead horse any deader by discussing Nova and how YOU (neither a fan of Nova nor the BE) feel about them.

But if you think that people hold two rent-a-player Marlin WS teams in the same regard as a team that won 14 straight division titles, then you and I will never agree. I can't name 3 players from either of those 2 Marlins WS champ teams but I will NEVER forget the Braves era that produced the Glavine--Smoltz--Madduz trio along with Chipper Jones and Bobby Cox. Consistent excellence. I'd take 14 straight div titles and a WS Championship over 12 mediocre years and 2 WS Championships any day of the week.

Really the only reason why the Braves would be viewed better is because they do have the WS title. If they had lost to Cleveland in '95- they aren't. And there are some folks that do look at the Marlins better than the Braves. And the Braves aren't viewed anywhere near as well as the Yankees- who had less regular season success- because the Yankees did better in the playoffs. It's not remotely close to most folks between the Yankees and Braves.

I look at Utah in the NBA. Stockton/Malone great players. But they aren't viewed anywhere near as good as they should be because they never won a title. Same with Dan Marino in the NFL. He's not viewed as high as Joe Montana. Why? The postseason. John Elway's legacy wasn't complete until he had the Super Bowl.

And sorry, but if you think that I'm alone in how I feel about Nova- you are an idiot. I challenge you to show me 1 preview from a mainstream outlet about Villanova this year that doesn't talk about the NCAA issues. Just 1. You aren't going to be able to because the postseason matters. Regular season excellence doesn't mean squat unless it's backed up by the postseason.

[ChestRockwell85]

I think we can all agree that Nova has done a great job of representing the league. Where the problem starts is one (maybe two) Nova fans taking things too seriously. Once the sniping begins, it tends to get out of control fast (and yes, I'm as guilty as any at this point).

At this point I am going to exit the thread. Have fun wherever it goes.

Marquette, what you need to understand is I grew up in and now again live in St. John's country. I am not talking about Manhattan where the majority of people don't know the Yankees and Mets are about to both make the playoffs. I am talking right outside Queens, where everybody knows somebody who went to St. John's, and if you didn't have another college hoops team to root for, they were the team. I might be a little quick on the trigger, but I have been dealing with this all my life, so it isn't just a message board that gets me going, it is listening to the same delusional nonsense for St. John's fans all my life.

My first post REALLY wasn't that harsh and I even somewhat apologized in the final paragraph of that initial post. But again, St. John's has had 5 different coaches in the last 15 years, I know who Chris Mullin is and his recruiting thus far has been good, good, not great, but good. The fact that Jordan and Obepka decided not to come back is probably a blessing in disguise, but it didn't lead me to believe that kids who weren't alive until 1995 are about to start bowing down to Chris Mullin, a guy that people from that age group are really not that familiar with.

I don't blame St. John's fans for having high hopes, we all do because we need all teams in the Big East to be competitive now, but haven't the last 15 years taught you anything?!?!?!?!?!?! Let's see how this thing plays out before you start saying a coach who has never coached a college game in his life is more safe in his job than a coach who just brought his team to 9 out of last 10 NCAA tournaments, not to mention an elite eight and a final four. I know how things have played out for Villanova the last few years but the fact that we are even there says A LOT more than most teams.

High hopes for Mullin, but I had every right to be like, "are you kidding me?" after the initial post and remind the poster that Mullin just took over a debacle, not Duke.

Name change i see? Did you get booted for your freak outs?

Nope, I guess I had 2 logins. I didn't even realize. Freak outs? Like really? And we are the sensitive ones?