The Holy Land of Hoops

So most of the schools have a clear coach that brought the school to a level that it hasn't returned to.

How would you rank these coaches from top to bottom? (You'll notice I kept NIT finals as successful pre NCAA moving to 64 teams)

McGuire: 295-80, NIT runner up in 67, won 1970 NIT, NCAA runner up in 74 and won it in 77

Thompson: 596-239, NCAA runner up in 82 and 85 won it in 84

Massimino: 357-241, NCAA champion in 85

Carneseca: 526-200, Final 4 in 85

Gavitt: 209-84, NIT runner up in 75, Final four in 73

Carlesimo: 212-166, NCAA final in 89

Meyer: 724-354, NIT runner up in 44 and 83, won NIT in 45, NCAA Final Four in 43 and 79

Stevens: 84-22, NCAA runner up in 2010 and 2011

Xavier I didn't know who to go with because Miller and Matta both took you guys to an elite 8 and Mack's brought you to 3 sweet 16s.

Creighton didn't know who to go with because there's no NIT finals and no NCAA final fours.

I really wouldn't count the NIT teams from 75 on. 1975 was the first tournament where more than 1 team per conference was allowed in the tournament. So like especially for DePaul in '83- there's no way to say that was special. PC in '75 maybe a bit more impressive just because that was the 1st time ever. But by 1983 with 52 teams if you were good you were getting into the tournament.

Thompson to me has to be #1 on the list over Meyer. He won a national championship and had a better winning percentage- with most of his work done in a lot tougher era. Would have McGuire, Massimino, and Carneseca in that next group. Gavitt, Carlesimo, and Stevens in the next group. Tough to pick for Xavier and Creighton.

MUBoxer wrote:So most of the schools have a clear coach that brought the school to a level that it hasn't returned to.

How would you rank these coaches from top to bottom? (You'll notice I kept NIT finals as successful pre NCAA moving to 64 teams)

McGuire: 295-80, NIT runner up in 67, won 1970 NIT, NCAA runner up in 74 and won it in 77

Thompson: 596-239, NCAA runner up in 82 and 85 won it in 84

Massimino: 357-241, NCAA champion in 85

Carneseca: 526-200, Final 4 in 85

Gavitt: 209-84, NIT runner up in 75, Final four in 73

Carlesimo: 212-166, NCAA final in 89

Meyer: 724-354, NIT runner up in 44 and 83, won NIT in 45, NCAA Final Four in 43 and 79

Stevens: 84-22, NCAA runner up in 2010 and 2011

Xavier I didn't know who to go with because Miller and Matta both took you guys to an elite 8 and Mack's brought you to 3 sweet 16s.

Creighton didn't know who to go with because there's no NIT finals and no NCAA final fours.

The list
McGuire
Thompson
Massimino
Stevens
Carnesecca
Gavitt
Miller
Carlesimo
Meyer

Reasoning
Yes, I'm biased, but here's the thing to remember. The only team that won more games than Marquette in the 1970s was John Wooden's UCLA. In the days of a 25-team NCAA Tournament, that 1970 NIT win is as good as a National title in my book.

Yes, Massimino beat Thompson in 85, but he caught lightning in a bottle, whereas Thompson's Hoyas were the league bully for years. Massimino's record in getting teams to the second weekend (5 times) is impressive though.

Stevens deserves a ton of credit for putting two teams in the NCAA title game, and being a ball-hair away from winning it all with Horizon League recruiting, and likewise with Carnesecca considering St. John's was pretty much considered a commuter school at the time. Gavitt only failed to win 20 games twice in 10 seasons, and his vision for the formation of the Big East earns extra cudos.

Sean Miller gets the nod for Xavier, though Mack may well surpass him eventually. Carlesimo's winning percentage is a little low.

Ray Meyer at the bottom. For the way DePaul reveres him, you'd think he was freakin' Roy Williams. Ray Meyer coached DePaul for 42 years. Of those 42 years, he failed to win 20 games 31 times. THIRTY-ONE TIMES. Meyer did take DePaul to the Final Four in 1979 as part of a stretch where the Blue Demons made the NCAA Tournament 7 times in 9 seasons in the 70s and early 80s. However, before that stretch began, Meyer had taken DePaul to the NCAA Tournament six times in 33 seasons.

Some day, Miller, Stevens and Carlesimo can come to Springfield and visit Ray Meyer's Hall of Fame exhibit.

if all these guys were still coaching at our respective schools we'd be by far the toughest league in the country.

With all due respect to Brad Stevens, the Butler icon is and always will be Paul D. 'Tony" Hinkle. He coached at Butler for half a century, coaching baseball, basketball and football.

Hinkle is in the Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame, the Helms Foundation Basketball Hall of Fame, the Indiana Basketball Hall of Fame, the NACDA Hall of Fame and the Butler Athletic Hall of Fame.

Overall Record for Coach Hinkle
165–99–13 (football)
560–392 (basketball)
335–309–3 (baseball)

Someone has to mention Tony Barone at Creighton. He was great with them. They upset New Mexico State in '91, before playing Seton Hall tough in a 2nd round loss. I was surprised things didn't work out at Texas A&M for him. Jays fans ---> the HLoH wants Barone stories.

Also, CU gave the legendary Eddie Sutton his first head coaching gig.

Creighton administration was considering sacking athletics in the early 90's as the Rick Johnson hire as HC after Barone left had driven the program into the ground and Prez Fr. Morrison didn't give two shits about athletics.

Bruce Rasmussen's hire of Dana Altman was either going to work or athletics was going to vaporize. Flash forward 20 year and now we're in the Big East. Let that roll around in your head awhile...20 years ago athletics was on the chopping block and now..........

Rasmussen and Altman should have freaking shrines built to them and, in fact, Rasmussen's name is on our facility housing women's basketball and volleyball. Best freaking AD no one has ever heard of. On the NCAA Selection Committee this year too.

The only injustice is the state-of-the-art soccer stadium is named after Morrison. What a f***ing joke.

http://www.omaha.com/article/20130723/B ... /130729485

Was well before my time but Red was a very good coach and very colorful guy.

ljay wrote:Creighton administration was considering sacking athletics in the early 90's as the Rick Johnson hire as HC after Barone left had driven the program into the ground and Prez Fr. Morrison didn't give two shits about athletics.

Bruce Rasmussen's hire of Dana Altman was either going to work or athletics was going to vaporize. Flash forward 20 year and now we're in the Big East. Let that roll around in your head awhile...20 years ago athletics was on the chopping block and now..........

Rasmussen and Altman should have freaking shrines built to them and, in fact, Rasmussen's name is on our facility housing women's basketball and volleyball. Best freaking AD no one has ever heard of. On the NCAA Selection Committee this year too.

The only injustice is the state-of-the-art soccer stadium is named after Morrison. What a f***ing joke.

I was wondering who would bring up Altmann. Good coach there.