Tues 1/14 BE Game Thread (2 Games).

[MUBoxer]

We will probably take a small step back next year. DM is DM. But our two great point guards are back, as are our two best bigs, a very good two in Dingman, a very good set of redshirts, and two special freshman. Leon Gilmore continues our Texas pipeline--I think he will be scary good. My prediction is some bumps early, but then they start to click. We have the best facilities in the BE, a great coaching staff and AD, and the Clink has become the toughest venue to play. The crowds have been simply amazing. Please do yourself a favor and come.

How exactly do you know you have the best practice facilities? I mean remember most of the schools have making more $$ from and investing in bball longer so how do you know you have the best?

[jays911]

Didn't mean to upset anyone. It is more due to our Sker neighbors. Supposedly, they opened the best in the country this year, with iPads at every shitter or something. Anyway, we are opening the Rasmussen center next year, which is supposed to outshine our Sker neighbors. Believe me, this was not aimed at our BE friends. We just get tired of the idiots in Lincoln. But come see our arena--there ain't anything like the Clink in the BE, except for, maybe, the Garden. And MSG is getting old.
And I mean it, you will be welcomed at the Clink. Peace.

[JaysOldfan]

Dear Big East Brethren,

Creighton basketball did not start 4 years ago with Doug McDermott. We were a Top 10 team with Kyle Korver 10 years ago. We have 2 players currently in the NBA. We have put multiple teams into the NCAA tournament in every decade since the 1960's. We been in the top 25 for attendance for 7 straight years. We've won at least 10 conference games for 17 years in a row. Kansas is the only other school that has shown that consistency. We've been to 9 NCAA tournaments since 1999.

Please don't act like we just started caring about basketball in the last 4 years - its insulting. Sure, we lack the postseason success that could raise the national prominence of our program. We all wish we had been able to make some March noise, but it just hasn't happened for whatever reason. However, our program's history of sustained success is comparable to, or greater than, quite a few programs in the BE. That being said, we have upped our game as a program the last few years to help us get over the hump and truly become an elite national program.

[handdownmandown]

Where are all the threads about the fears about Butler not being able to keep the program at a high level? This has been brought up adnauseam the last three weeks when it comes to CU but not them. Theyre 0-5, lost their messiah of a coach and just got boat raced, but let's talk about the fear of us crashing.

Not coincidentally, this all popped up when people were forced to abandon the 'Its the BE and not the MVC, so theyre bound to struggle some no matter who they have' mantra, while barely acknowledging when we point out that we didnt just start excelling. This is at best an argument for another day and at worst jealousy tinged. What happens if we go to the F4 and land a huge class in 15 and don't fall off much at all? How about that possibility?

Worry about yourselves. Other than Nova, right now everyone in this league has their own minuses to sweat.

[XU85]

Creighton Brethren:

There are always going to be those who piss on Santa Claus. You guys have a great thing going, for which the rest of us should be grateful. X endured many of the same negative future predictions. Let's enjoy the ride...

[marquette]

The funny thing is, when people from the country act like they are in some major city, they don't realize it's still rural to New Yorkers. I live 35 miles east of the Queens border on Long Island aka the NYC suburbs. People in Queens think I live in the "boonies" 45 minutes east of them with houses right next to each other, .5 acre property, and backyards just big enough to fit a pool or deck and that's it. Yet to most of the country we are essentially greater NYC. So when the suburbs of NYC are more densely populated and more urban than Omaha, of course we are going to say it's all farm land out there lol. My uncle said it best when he did a cross country drive. He said, "Each coast has major cities and suburbs of major cities with stuff going on…everything in between is just farms".

As a person who spent a substantial amount of time on the east coast, New Yorkers tend to get an over-inflated ego for no reason other than they live in each other's personal space. We get it, you all live really close together. Hooray for you. You can get a beer at 4:45 in the morning, at a bar. Hooray for you. You can hop a train to New Jersey and watch two different football teams. Hooray for New Jersey? The funny thing about New Yorkers is that they hate every other New Yorker, while simultaneously justifying their horrible living conditions (seriously, look up what you can get in NYC for what you pay in your current city) by claiming they live in the greatest city in the world. Take it from me, I've been to cities just as large, just as densely populated, and filled with nicer people than NYC. I suggest you hop over the pond to London, or the other way to Tokyo, if you want to see what you are missing out on.

Your uncle doesn't know what he's talking about and clearly has lived next to none of his life outside of NYC metro. Ignorant statements like that give New Yorkers an even worse name. Between the coasts there are cities like Chicago, Houston, Phoenix, San Antonio, Dallas, Austin, Indianapolis, Columbus, and many more. As far as stuff going on, where do you think the world's largest music festival is? Little, out of the way, backwoods Milwaukee, Wisconsin. I actually have more sports options within a short train ride than you do in NYC. I can watch the Brewers, Bucks, Bulls, Bears, Cubs, White Sox, Blackhawks, or Fire without ever getting off the trains. Packers are a hop skip and a jump up north in a car or bus. That's not even mentioning the dozens of semi-pro and minor league teams. I can eat out at 2, 3, or 4 am without any great difficulty in my tiny little Midwest hick town. I can find a show, a sporting event, a movie, a place to drink or any number of other entertainment options any night of the week in my tiny little redneck haven. We have, in our hick, country little towns, most things that can be found in NYC, along with much nicer people, cleaner air and water, and enough living space that I can stretch my arms without hitting somebody else in the face (doesn't cost me an arm and a leg either, so I get to travel as a bonus).

In summation, quit taking a dump on other conference members because of your own ignorance. We all feel bad that St. John's is having a rough stretch, but that's really got nothing to do with insulting other cities.

(Admin, feel free to delete this post if it seems over the top. I'm just getting kind of sick of seeing the above kind of posts on here.)

[xu155]

Creighton fans,

I'm a little sensitive to this argument as well. Although Xavier has been getting more of the benefit of the doubt lately, it took a while to earn that. Creighton has had a lot of success as well, so I'm certainly not ready to say that they will fall off and never come back after this year.

What I do believe however, is that it is kind of crazy for a team that bases its success on offense, and loses the NPOY as well as Wragge and Gibbs, to expect huge success the following year. Doug is AWESOME, and he does so much for that team. Wragge can be an unconciously hot shooter sometimes (as seen on Sunday), and that covers up a lot of things.

My thing here is that I wonder if the older McDermott can coach defense well enough to get a less star-laden team to have more of the same success and a deep tourney run or two.

The reason I have such faith in Xavier's success to continue is that their success is largely based on defense (not to mention recruiting seems to be going nowhere but up). It took a totally depleted roster last year to keep them out of the NCAA's last year for the first time in quite a while, and they were somehow still in the conversation until the end.

I think Creighton will continue to have a good program, and WILL NOT be a Big East bottom-dweller after this year by any means. I do think that a step back next year is absolutely expected. The lack of defensive emphasis is my basis for that (without ridiculously awesome shooting to cover it up).

[Lavinwood]

Dear Big East Brethren,

Creighton basketball did not start 4 years ago with Doug McDermott. We were a Top 10 team with Kyle Korver 10 years ago. We have 2 players currently in the NBA. We have put multiple teams into the NCAA tournament in every decade since the 1960's. We been in the top 25 for attendance for 7 straight years. We've won at least 10 conference games for 17 years in a row. Kansas is the only other school that has shown that consistency. We've been to 9 NCAA tournaments since 1999.

Please don't act like we just started caring about basketball in the last 4 years - its insulting. Sure, we lack the postseason success that could raise the national prominence of our program. We all wish we had been able to make some March noise, but it just hasn't happened for whatever reason. However, our program's history of sustained success is comparable to, or greater than, quite a few programs in the BE. That being said, we have upped our game as a program the last few years to help us get over the hump and truly become an elite national program.

And I respect the Creighton program, but you are coming from being the shark in your conference to being in a big ocean of other sharks now. No disrespect to the MVC but Creighton would definitely not have that same success in the Big East over that same amount of time. I don't think attendance is anything too crazy to brag about. Good teams draw, bad teams don't. I don't think it "says" anything about the fanbase being superior. It's directly related to how the program is doing. SJ sold out the Garden in 2011 when they made their crazy run of beating 4 top 10 teams. It's one thing to have sustained success as a mid major being easily the best in your conference year after year. I went to Marist for undergrad and the women's team is always one of the top mid majors and has even been ranked a few times while routinely beating ranked power conference programs. They always win the MAAC...I think it's a decade straight. And there are some undefeated seasons in there too including a Sweet 16 appearance. But not for a second do I think they'd do that in the Big East. Same with Creighton. This is why I said don't take Doug for granted...you have the BEST player in the NATION. The guy AVERAGES near 30 PPG! He doesn't miss from 3 and he doesn't miss in mid range. He doesn't miss in general. Losing a Wooden Award winner from a team that just stepped out of the mid major shadows is a major blow. Look what happened when Mullin left SJ. Shambles save for maybe 3 good years since. Creighton has not proven it can play as a major team in a major conference and reload and still win consistently yet. We know they can win with a Wooden Award player...that's not hard. What is hard is reloading over and over, finding gems recruiting, repeatedly having to face Nova, G'Town, Marquette, etc. It wears on your team.

And again I'm very glad Creighton is here and I respect the program, but when you step up to the Big East you need to prove your worth here for a while not just 1 year. Showing your MVC resume won't cut it. It's way easier for a top mid major in a less competitive conference to dominate every year and get the auto bid as opposed to being a major team playing with some blue bloods dominating every year and getting at large bids in years when you don't win the tourney. Creighton can definitely do it, but I just want to see them prove it before we just assume. One thing I learned from SJ armed with 6 top 100 recruits including a 5 star is that you can never assume you will win. This conference will humble you fast.

[Chalmers0]

Where are all the threads about the fears about Butler not being able to keep the program at a high level? This has been brought up adnauseam the last three weeks when it comes to CU but not them. Theyre 0-5, lost their messiah of a coach and just got boat raced, but let's talk about the fear of us crashing.

Not coincidentally, this all popped up when people were forced to abandon the 'Its the BE and not the MVC, so theyre bound to struggle some no matter who they have' mantra, while barely acknowledging when we point out that we didnt just start excelling. This is at best an argument for another day and at worst jealousy tinged. What happens if we go to the F4 and land a huge class in 15 and don't fall off much at all? How about that possibility?

Worry about yourselves. Other than Nova, right now everyone in this league has their own minuses to sweat.

Agreed, from the day Brad Stevens left I said I was worried about Butler's future for various reasons. I am definitely worried about Creighton post-McDermott but I am more worried about Butler going forward...

[Lavinwood]

The thing I don't think Creighton fans realize is that guys like McDermott are once in a program players. We had Mullin who won the Wooden Award, led SJ to a Final Four, is regarded as possibly the greatest or among the greatest pure shooters ever, NBA HOF, Dream Team gold medal winner with team USA playing alongside Jordan, etc. Everyone has that one...then they leave and it becomes a fond memory. I think Creighton can still get good players but they will never have another McDermott.

It's very important to realize that McDermott is the rare exception not the rule. He was a 2 star recruit. How often do 2 star recruits become Wooden Award winners? How often do they become the best player in your history? He may very well be the only one ever. And how many times does a player like that stay all 4 years? In this day in age, VERY rarely. His father is the head coach...if the coach was some random guy he would have left after 2 years. Your recruits will not be the son of your coach going forward. So if you are lucky enough to find a gem, they will promptly leave after 1 year or 2 at most. I don't think it's going too far to be concerned what Creighton will be with no McDermott or even Gibbs going forward. You can't come from the MVC to the Big East acting like a 5 star general with tons of medals and scars from war without earning it. In the MVC that's what Creighton was, but you need to understand you are now in a conference with teams who have made 25+ tournament appearances with Final Four's, Elite 8's, Sweet Sixteens, and championships on their resume. This is a different beast. Also remember you are playing with probably your best team you will have while SJ, SHU, Butler, and Marquette are either rebuilding or in very down years. That won't be the case for long. Prove that you guys are more than a 4 year Wooden player and you can reload year after year and make top 25 appearances still, and no one will question you. We WANT you guys to by the way...it's good for the conference so don't take it personally.

Xavier had the same questions but they earned it the old fashioned way...by reloading year after year, almost always being ranked, almost always going deep in the tourney, and consistently scheduling and beating big time teams. And this has nothing to do with sour grapes about SJ doing terrible by the way. I know you guys want us to do well just like I want you guys to do well unless we play each other. Butler gets a slight pass because we still don't know what the real effect Stevens leaving will have. They still went to back to back national championship games and lost a heartbreaker to Kansas. Obviously there are still questions with them rebounding from their coaching loss, but they also haven't been the type of program to rely on 1 player so much like McDermott.