My Private/Parochial Conference Wish

[DudeAnon]

Belive me, no one at UD from the fans to the administraion wants to be part of the BE. There was some interest last year but thats all it was just curiosity.

Everyone at UD is very satisfied with the A10 and for the same reasons that Buzz left Marquette, UD will never join. It is interesting that this information has not filtered to this blog.

Oh I forgot, you are all living in the Fox News bubble of mis-information

murphy, you are doing more harm than good.

just a hunch, probably their intention.

Might of been his intention, but most UD fans I know are passionate about UD without being delusional.

[DudeAnon]

I'm not here to troll or trash; just a simple comment:

As a UD alum and fan, I am 100% certain the school would (and should) join the Big East if ever given the opportunity.

That is what Dr. Curran's been working towards since he became President and nothing has changed with last year's success. Dayton is a Catholic school with a strong basketball tradition/heritage and would be best served aligning with similar institutions. I find it interesting UD is so polarizing to many on this board--as it's similar in many ways to all of the Big East members--Academics (with an exception or two), Culture, Size, Mission, etc.

I believe you're failing to put this into proper context. UD is a good school. However, notwithstanding what happened this past season, it's basketball tradition is faded. UD has been pretty bad for a long time otherwise.

Beyond all that, it's not about UD polarizing fans here; it's about UD fans on that board being delusional. I haven't visited that board for a while, but I can't imagine it has changed all that much. A lot of those guys actually thought UD had a chance at being invited into the Big East. Now that that has not happened, they take the position that UD is much better off remaining in the A10.

Having noted that, the guys on Blackburn Review are actually reasonably objective and truly funny.

I think you are selling UD and its fans short.

For one, most of their fans are fans are nothing like the trolls online. Also, they have a great community. There are a lot of people who in Cincinnati who arent a fan of UC or XU. There are ZERO people from Dayton who aren't fans of Dayton. So you have to give their fan base credit.

And I think you are wrong that UD fans are delusional for thinking they might of gotten an invite to the NBE. They are as good a fit as Xavier is except for recent NCAA success. And as great as Xavier's NCAA success has been in the last 10 years, things change fast. If UD makes another run next year I can guarantee you the average fan will think UD is a better program than X.

So lets keep our heads cool. UD is a great program, that probably would've been invited had it not been for their recent NCAA disappointments.

[Xudash]

I'm not here to troll or trash; just a simple comment:

As a UD alum and fan, I am 100% certain the school would (and should) join the Big East if ever given the opportunity.

That is what Dr. Curran's been working towards since he became President and nothing has changed with last year's success. Dayton is a Catholic school with a strong basketball tradition/heritage and would be best served aligning with similar institutions. I find it interesting UD is so polarizing to many on this board--as it's similar in many ways to all of the Big East members--Academics (with an exception or two), Culture, Size, Mission, etc.

I believe you're failing to put this into proper context. UD is a good school. However, notwithstanding what happened this past season, it's basketball tradition is faded. UD has been pretty bad for a long time otherwise.

Beyond all that, it's not about UD polarizing fans here; it's about UD fans on that board being delusional. I haven't visited that board for a while, but I can't imagine it has changed all that much. A lot of those guys actually thought UD had a chance at being invited into the Big East. Now that that has not happened, they take the position that UD is much better off remaining in the A10.

Having noted that, the guys on Blackburn Review are actually reasonably objective and truly funny.

I think you are selling UD and its fans short.

For one, most of their fans are fans are nothing like the trolls online. Also, they have a great community. There are a lot of people who in Cincinnati who arent a fan of UC or XU. There are ZERO people from Dayton who aren't fans of Dayton. So you have to give their fan base credit.

And I think you are wrong that UD fans are delusional for thinking they might of gotten an invite to the NBE. They are as good a fit as Xavier is except for recent NCAA success. And as great as Xavier's NCAA success has been in the last 10 years, things change fast. If UD makes another run next year I can guarantee you the average fan will think UD is a better program than X.

So lets keep our heads cool. UD is a great program, that probably would've been invited had it not been for their recent NCAA disappointments.

Zero? I know of at least a few fans of Xavier who reside in Dayton, and I can assure you they are not fans of UD. I suspect there are numerous OSU fans who reside in Dayton who couldn't care less about UD. There have to be alumni from other schools who feel the same way as well.

More to the point, if you think one more year of success for UD would equate to Xavier's resume, You are not being honest with yourself. Assuming Archie can sustain a successful track record there, he will do what his brother did: leave for a major program. Sean had it made at Xavier. He was the big dog at X. Xavier was leaps and bounds ahead of UD at that point. Yet, he chose to leave for Arizona.

Xavier has demonstrated an ability to replace very strong coaches with very strong coaches. UD has a terrible track record in this regard. So, while you are entitled to your opinion, I guess I am entitled to mine: the gap between Xavier and UD remains wide. There is no guaranty UD can replace Archie if he leaves, and he isn't fully proven yet anyway.

I don't believe it matters anyway. As far as the Big East is concerned, it has it's Ohio team. And it appears as though it has no desire to pursue expansion at this point if expansion means expanding with A10 teams at this point. It may ultimately come to that, but the initiative will not start there. If it ends up there, it certainly isn't a given UD will make the cut.

[NJRedman]

We get it X fans, you don't like Dayton. That has no bearing on if UD will or will not get an invite should the conference decide to expand to 12. The horse is dead, quit beating it.

[HoosierPal]

I had to go to Spokane WA on business this week. First note: It takes FOREVER to get there. From Indy you have the options of Chicago, Minny, or Denver to catch a connecting flight. A short 7 hours later, you are in Spokane. I pity the 6'6" volleyball players that would have to ride commercial from any airport east of the Mississippi to Spokane.

I took the time to drive through Gonzaga's campus. It is a non-descript campus to say the least. If you are looking for an 'attractive campus' don't look at Gonzaga. By far the most impressive structure on campus was the new baseball stadium. It doesn't rank up there with Omaha, but for an on-campus non-SEC stadium, it was very nice. The on-site McCarthey Athletic Center is rather small (6,000 capacity) and showing some age from the outside, even though it was renovated 10 years ago.

The campus is located in a university district where WSU and EWU each has a branch campus. Those buildings were much newer and nicer in appearance than what I saw on the Gonzaga campus. But it really doesn't matter what a building looks like from the outside, it is important for what happens within.

What is there to do in Spokane? Well the concert being advertised on local billboards was the Village People and Men at Work. Oh boy. I will say that the Spokane area is very attractive. There are tons of outdoor activities to choose from.

The attraction for a student-athlete to attend Gonzaga has to be the coaching staff. Changes in the coaching staff could have an impact on the sustained success of their athletic programs. [I have no knowledge of what academic programs excel at Gonzaga and am not going to research it.]

[Omaha1]

The attraction for a student-athlete to attend Gonzaga has to be the coaching staff. Changes in the coaching staff could have an impact on the sustained success of their athletic programs. [I have no knowledge of what academic programs excel at Gonzaga and am not going to research it.]

Without sounding overly negative, I think a lot of people have the same concerns about Butler.

[Xudash]

I had to go to Spokane WA on business this week. First note: It takes FOREVER to get there. From Indy you have the options of Chicago, Minny, or Denver to catch a connecting flight. A short 7 hours later, you are in Spokane. I pity the 6'6" volleyball players that would have to ride commercial from any airport east of the Mississippi to Spokane.

I took the time to drive through Gonzaga's campus. It is a non-descript campus to say the least. If you are looking for an 'attractive campus' don't look at Gonzaga. By far the most impressive structure on campus was the new baseball stadium. It doesn't rank up there with Omaha, but for an on-campus non-SEC stadium, it was very nice. The on-site McCarthey Athletic Center is rather small (6,000 capacity) and showing some age from the outside, even though it was renovated 10 years ago.

The campus is located in a university district where WSU and EWU each has a branch campus. Those buildings were much newer and nicer in appearance than what I saw on the Gonzaga campus. But it really doesn't matter what a building looks like from the outside, it is important for what happens within.

What is there to do in Spokane? Well the concert being advertised on local billboards was the Village People and Men at Work. Oh boy. I will say that the Spokane area is very attractive. There are tons of outdoor activities to choose from.

The attraction for a student-athlete to attend Gonzaga has to be the coaching staff. Changes in the coaching staff could have an impact on the sustained success of their athletic programs. [I have no knowledge of what academic programs excel at Gonzaga and am not going to research it.]

Good feedback Hoosier.

It is good to keep in mind that Gonzaga's newish - 10 years old now - basketball facility has a capacity of approximately 6000. As attractive as that school is right now, imagine if it did have a falloff in performance and this conference were left with the logistics involved in having them as a member.

NJRedman, it's not all Xavier fans, it's me with my opinion and me having an exchange with Dude. If you don't want to read these posts, then don't read them. It's a message board. You are not editor-in-chief around here. For better or for worse, the expansion topic will stay alive around here for the foreseeable future. Besides, it's the summertime, so some amount of this kind of dialogue is going to take place here.

[Jet915]

The attraction for a student-athlete to attend Gonzaga has to be the coaching staff. Changes in the coaching staff could have an impact on the sustained success of their athletic programs. [I have no knowledge of what academic programs excel at Gonzaga and am not going to research it.]

Without sounding overly negative, I think a lot of people have the same concerns about Butler.

Butler has some things Gonzaga doesn't though. Indianapolis is a gigantic metro city compared to Spokane. They play in a historic arena (Hinkle). Indiana is a hotbed for hoops recruiting as well.

[NJRedman]

I had to go to Spokane WA on business this week. First note: It takes FOREVER to get there. From Indy you have the options of Chicago, Minny, or Denver to catch a connecting flight. A short 7 hours later, you are in Spokane. I pity the 6'6" volleyball players that would have to ride commercial from any airport east of the Mississippi to Spokane.

I took the time to drive through Gonzaga's campus. It is a non-descript campus to say the least. If you are looking for an 'attractive campus' don't look at Gonzaga. By far the most impressive structure on campus was the new baseball stadium. It doesn't rank up there with Omaha, but for an on-campus non-SEC stadium, it was very nice. The on-site McCarthey Athletic Center is rather small (6,000 capacity) and showing some age from the outside, even though it was renovated 10 years ago.

The campus is located in a university district where WSU and EWU each has a branch campus. Those buildings were much newer and nicer in appearance than what I saw on the Gonzaga campus. But it really doesn't matter what a building looks like from the outside, it is important for what happens within.

What is there to do in Spokane? Well the concert being advertised on local billboards was the Village People and Men at Work. Oh boy. I will say that the Spokane area is very attractive. There are tons of outdoor activities to choose from.

The attraction for a student-athlete to attend Gonzaga has to be the coaching staff. Changes in the coaching staff could have an impact on the sustained success of their athletic programs. [I have no knowledge of what academic programs excel at Gonzaga and am not going to research it.]

Good feedback Hoosier.

It is good to keep in mind that Gonzaga's newish - 10 years old now - basketball facility has a capacity of approximately 6000. As attractive as that school is right now, imagine if it did have a falloff in performance and this conference were left with the logistics involved in having them as a member.

NJRedman, it's not all Xavier fans, it's me with my opinion and me having an exchange with Dude. If you don't want to read these posts, then don't read them. It's a message board. You are not editor-in-chief around here. For better or for worse, the expansion topic will stay alive around here for the foreseeable future. Besides, it's the summertime, so some amount of this kind of dialogue is going to take place here.

Pretty sure I could go back in older threads and find a lot of other X fans bitching about UD. Never said i was the editor in chief and it's my opinion the X bashing of UD is like beating a dead horse. If you don't like that post then don't read it.

[AdamTheFlyer]

Zero? I know of at least a few fans of Xavier who reside in Dayton, and I can assure you they are not fans of UD. I suspect there are numerous OSU fans who reside in Dayton who couldn't care less about UD. There have to be alumni from other schools who feel the same way as well.

More to the point, if you think one more year of success for UD would equate to Xavier's resume, You are not being honest with yourself. Assuming Archie can sustain a successful track record there, he will do what his brother did: leave for a major program. Sean had it made at Xavier. He was the big dog at X. Xavier was leaps and bounds ahead of UD at that point. Yet, he chose to leave for Arizona.

Xavier has demonstrated an ability to replace very strong coaches with very strong coaches. UD has a terrible track record in this regard. So, while you are entitled to your opinion, I guess I am entitled to mine: the gap between Xavier and UD remains wide. There is no guaranty UD can replace Archie if he leaves, and he isn't fully proven yet anyway.

I don't believe it matters anyway. As far as the Big East is concerned, it has it's Ohio team. And it appears as though it has no desire to pursue expansion at this point if expansion means expanding with A10 teams at this point. It may ultimately come to that, but the initiative will not start there. If it ends up there, it certainly isn't a given UD will make the cut.

I wasn't going to join this site, just lurk once in a while as a basketball fan, but I had to respond to this.

There are people in every town who don't root for the home team. It's life. Heck, Cincinnati has far more OSU and Notre Dame football fans than UC. That said, a very high percentage of basketball fans in the Dayton DMA consider UD their favorite team. I have seen the market data from FS Ohio. It's staggering, something like 58%. For comparison, OSU football is at like 64% in Columbus. Anything approaching 50% is utter dominance in the market.

On what planet has UD had a terrible track record hiring coaches? Dayton has had 6 coaches since 1947. Tom Blackburn made them into a national name. Don Donoher made them into a national power for the better part of 30 years. Jim O'Brien was terrible. Oliver Purnell took over a program that won 10 games combined in 2 seasons, and in 8 years made two NCAAs and his final season led them to a league title, a #16 ranking, and a 4 seed. Brian Gregory's tenure was ultimately a bit underwhelming, but was far from "terrible", and it was more successful than Purnell. In 3 years Archie Miller has completely rebuilt a roster that scattered just before and just after the coaching change, and in 3 years already has an Elite 8 trip.

6 hires in 67 years, 4 have left the program in better shape than they found it, and 1 looks pretty dang good so far. Five out of six hires had success. There are dozens of schools who would kill to make a pretty quality hire 83% of the time over 70 years.

It's ok to not like Dayton. It's not ok to use that dislike to spread ignorant non-truths.

As far as expansion, I can say this with direct knowledge from someone at Fox Sports Ohio. If and when the Big East expands, Dayton and St Louis will be at the very top of the list. In fact, Dayton would get the call before SLU. Fox wants them. The plan from day 1 between Fox and the Presidents was a 12 team league. It was only after the deal with Fox that basketball coaches were able to talk Fox and the presidents down to 10 for no other reason than scheduling. Xavier was added because of their track record. Butler because they were an "it" name with an "it" coach. Creighton was added because Marquette did the hard sell for their board room brother in arms. From February when news broke all the way into June, people at Fox Sports Ohio were told Dayton was to be added and to prepare for advertising in July. Then in June things changed when the bball coaches got their way, they said 10 teams would work and a commissioner too new to have any real power to govern basketball backed them. Fox agreed to back off their demand for 12 for a few years, because they got 10 years at a very cheap rate (by TV standards) out of the deal. They called the coaches' bluff.

But here's the kicker: It's not working as well as people want to believe. Fox was fine with FS1 ratings, although both Fox and the league were a bit disappointed (they wrote it off as Georgetown and Marquette being down), but Fox is less than happy with 10 because it gives FS2 little inventory to use to gain better carriage, and regional outlets get creamed on non-NBA game days (the ones that carry NBA games). Regional outlets are pretty mad that CBS Sports gets the better pick of games over them, despite the fact that the regionals do way better within the footprint than CBS Sports because they are on basic tiers. The east coast isn't as Fox regional heavy, I think only NESN is within the Fox regional family, but the midwest is. FSOhio, Midwest/North/KC (whichever covers Omaha), and Wisconsin were not happy at all.

If Fox fails to add the NBA or Big Ten (and both will almost certainly re-sign with ESPN), the Big East may become a 16 team league by 2018. They have to get more games for FS2 and the regionals. Getting the NBA and/or Big Ten would do that by pushing more Big East games to those channels. Without the NBA and/or Big Ten, a near certain reality, there is really only one way to get those games...