Conference Realignment Thread v. 2016

[Bill Marsh]

Great first post HUSTLE.

Thanks billyjack. I've lurked for a while and figured that the ACC is in my wheelhouse, so I might as well contribute. Just to give everyone a little bit of background on myself...

I grew up in Richmond and was fortunate enough to ballboy a bunch of University of Richmond games during Beilein's and Wainwright's head coaching tenures. My best friend is from a family of UR alumni - his uncle worked on the scorer's table and his grandfather was the head statistician for 50 years. I have lots of great memories from that time and was fortunate enough to be so close to a bunch of guys who turned out to be NBA players: David West from Xavier, Jameer Nelson & Delonte West during their St. Joe's years, and Hakim Warrick in a NIT game in 2002. I was at VT during the high points of Seth Greenberg's tenure (well, at least that one year we made the tournament!) and during my final year at school, watched my hometown go crazy for VCU when they made their 2011 Final 4 run. Since then, my dad had season tickets for a few years to VCU games, so I've been lucky to see lots of good basketball.

As proud as I would be to see either school from my hometown in the Big East, I don't really have a dog in the fight. Basketball is my first love though, so I've always had an affinity for the Big East and all the great games & players the conference has produced over the years.

Big Beilein fan here. But I know things can look different from up close. What's your take on him?

[H.U.S.T.L.E.]

Great first post HUSTLE.

Thanks billyjack. I've lurked for a while and figured that the ACC is in my wheelhouse, so I might as well contribute. Just to give everyone a little bit of background on myself...

I grew up in Richmond and was fortunate enough to ballboy a bunch of University of Richmond games during Beilein's and Wainwright's head coaching tenures. My best friend is from a family of UR alumni - his uncle worked on the scorer's table and his grandfather was the head statistician for 50 years. I have lots of great memories from that time and was fortunate enough to be so close to a bunch of guys who turned out to be NBA players: David West from Xavier, Jameer Nelson & Delonte West during their St. Joe's years, and Hakim Warrick in a NIT game in 2002. I was at VT during the high points of Seth Greenberg's tenure (well, at least that one year we made the tournament!) and during my final year at school, watched my hometown go crazy for VCU when they made their 2011 Final 4 run. Since then, my dad had season tickets for a few years to VCU games, so I've been lucky to see lots of good basketball.

As proud as I would be to see either school from my hometown in the Big East, I don't really have a dog in the fight. Basketball is my first love though, so I've always had an affinity for the Big East and all the great games & players the conference has produced over the years.

Big Beilein fan here. But I know things can look different from up close. What's your take on him?

Considering it's been almost 15 years since I've been around him and I was just in junior high at the time he left for WVU, it's hard to say if the increased spotlight has changed things. But honestly, I've never heard a bad thing about the guy. He was always great with me personally (not like I was anyone special) and we went to his basketball camps every summer. His youngest son is around the same age as me and their family was always super nice - his older sons were great too, as they often helped coach with the UR players at those camps.

Here's an anecdote that tells you a lot about him: near the end of our freshman year at VT, my best friend sent him an email to congratulate him after he got the Michigan job and Beilein sent a nice reply in return thanking him. Only a couple weeks later, the shootings at VT happened on April 16th. Beilein emailed him after that unfortunate day to check in on him - for that, I'll always have a soft spot in my heart for the guy.

I know he took some heat when it came out that Michigan was restricting Spike Albrecht from transferring to another B1G school, but the Beilein I remember has always been a class act. I know sentimentality has much to do with it, but I'll always root for his teams to succeed.

[Bluejay]

Regardless of what happens with the ACC, everything in the future of the Big XII hinges on what Texas does. Since Oklahoma is apparently on its way out the door, does Texas really want to hang around with the rest of that group without the Sooners?

Every one of the other 4 P5 conferences has been a rumored landing spot for the Longhorns. So, Ithink we'll just have to wait to see what Texas does. They've been pretty quiet lately. If there's any truth to the B1G - ACC rumor, it suggests that Texas has no interest in the B1G. They likely wouldn't have any interest in a decimated ACC either. That leaves the SEC or the PAC-12. Such a move would also leave the Big XII lifeless.

Oklahoma isn't going anywhere. Except for those kids that are native Sooners, most of Oklahoma's FB players come from within the state of Texas and that is why Oklahoma hitched its Sooner Schooner to Bevo years ago when the Big 12 was formed. This is just an airing of grievances with the hopes that other schools in the conference will pay attention and give Oklahoma some concessions that it wants.

[H.U.S.T.L.E.]

Regardless of what happens with the ACC, everything in the future of the Big XII hinges on what Texas does. Since Oklahoma is apparently on its way out the door, does Texas really want to hang around with the rest of that group without the Sooners?

Every one of the other 4 P5 conferences has been a rumored landing spot for the Longhorns. So, Ithink we'll just have to wait to see what Texas does. They've been pretty quiet lately. If there's any truth to the B1G - ACC rumor, it suggests that Texas has no interest in the B1G. They likely wouldn't have any interest in a decimated ACC either. That leaves the SEC or the PAC-12. Such a move would also leave the Big XII lifeless.

Oklahoma isn't going anywhere. Except for those kids that are native Sooners, most of Oklahoma's FB players come from within the state of Texas and that is why Oklahoma hitched its Sooner Schooner to Bevo years ago when the Big 12 was formed. This is just an airing of grievances with the hopes that other schools in the conference will pay attention and give Oklahoma some concessions that it wants.

I don't see how Oklahoma needs Texas any more at this point, especially if an invite to the SEC is on the table. While Texas A&M obviously doesn't have the same cache as Texas, the fact that there's already SEC market penetration in the state of Texas makes me think it's not a huge stumbling block.

I think the bigger issue Oklahoma faces in realignment is a similar one to the scenario I outlined with UVA/VT - the political pressure to keep Oklahoma & Oklahoma State in the same conference might sink any potential bid thrown Oklahoma's way.

[Xudash]

Regardless of what happens with the ACC, everything in the future of the Big XII hinges on what Texas does. Since Oklahoma is apparently on its way out the door, does Texas really want to hang around with the rest of that group without the Sooners?

Every one of the other 4 P5 conferences has been a rumored landing spot for the Longhorns. So, Ithink we'll just have to wait to see what Texas does. They've been pretty quiet lately. If there's any truth to the B1G - ACC rumor, it suggests that Texas has no interest in the B1G. They likely wouldn't have any interest in a decimated ACC either. That leaves the SEC or the PAC-12. Such a move would also leave the Big XII lifeless.

Oklahoma isn't going anywhere. Except for those kids that are native Sooners, most of Oklahoma's FB players come from within the state of Texas and that is why Oklahoma hitched its Sooner Schooner to Bevo years ago when the Big 12 was formed. This is just an airing of grievances with the hopes that other schools in the conference will pay attention and give Oklahoma some concessions that it wants.

I don't see how Oklahoma needs Texas any more at this point, especially if an invite to the SEC is on the table. While Texas A&M obviously doesn't have the same cache as Texas, the fact that there's already SEC market penetration in the state of Texas makes me think it's not a huge stumbling block.

I think the bigger issue Oklahoma faces in realignment is a similar one to the scenario I outlined with UVA/VT - the political pressure to keep Oklahoma & Oklahoma State in the same conference might sink any potential bid thrown Oklahoma's way.

Great having your insights and input here H.U.S.T.L.E.

I agree with you about the Sooners and Cowboys being politically linked, especially with T. Boone Pickens in the mix.

I can't see the B1G going to 20 for any amount of money, but I guess the B1G could go to 20 for both money and perceived demographic shifts that would affect long-term media deals. 20 - 4 pods of 5? - would be chalked up as the cost of doing business in modern collegiate sports, I guess.

[Bill Marsh]

Thanks billyjack. I've lurked for a while and figured that the ACC is in my wheelhouse, so I might as well contribute. Just to give everyone a little bit of background on myself...

I grew up in Richmond and was fortunate enough to ballboy a bunch of University of Richmond games during Beilein's and Wainwright's head coaching tenures. My best friend is from a family of UR alumni - his uncle worked on the scorer's table and his grandfather was the head statistician for 50 years. I have lots of great memories from that time and was fortunate enough to be so close to a bunch of guys who turned out to be NBA players: David West from Xavier, Jameer Nelson & Delonte West during their St. Joe's years, and Hakim Warrick in a NIT game in 2002. I was at VT during the high points of Seth Greenberg's tenure (well, at least that one year we made the tournament!) and during my final year at school, watched my hometown go crazy for VCU when they made their 2011 Final 4 run. Since then, my dad had season tickets for a few years to VCU games, so I've been lucky to see lots of good basketball.

As proud as I would be to see either school from my hometown in the Big East, I don't really have a dog in the fight. Basketball is my first love though, so I've always had an affinity for the Big East and all the great games & players the conference has produced over the years.

Big Beilein fan here. But I know things can look different from up close. What's your take on him?

Considering it's been almost 15 years since I've been around him and I was just in junior high at the time he left for WVU, it's hard to say if the increased spotlight has changed things. But honestly, I've never heard a bad thing about the guy. He was always great with me personally (not like I was anyone special) and we went to his basketball camps every summer. His youngest son is around the same age as me and their family was always super nice - his older sons were great too, as they often helped coach with the UR players at those camps.

Here's an anecdote that tells you a lot about him: near the end of our freshman year at VT, my best friend sent him an email to congratulate him after he got the Michigan job and Beilein sent a nice reply in return thanking him. Only a couple weeks later, the shootings at VT happened on April 16th. Beilein emailed him after that unfortunate day to check in on him - for that, I'll always have a soft spot in my heart for the guy.

I know he took some heat when it came out that Michigan was restricting Spike Albrecht from transferring to another B1G school, but the Beilein I remember has always been a class act. I know sentimentality has much to do with it, but I'll always root for his teams to succeed.

Thanks. That sounds like the same guy I see from afar. Like you, I'll always root for him too - both because I love the style of play he coaches and because he seems to be one of the good guys.

[Bill Marsh]

Regardless of what happens with the ACC, everything in the future of the Big XII hinges on what Texas does. Since Oklahoma is apparently on its way out the door, does Texas really want to hang around with the rest of that group without the Sooners?

Every one of the other 4 P5 conferences has been a rumored landing spot for the Longhorns. So, Ithink we'll just have to wait to see what Texas does. They've been pretty quiet lately. If there's any truth to the B1G - ACC rumor, it suggests that Texas has no interest in the B1G. They likely wouldn't have any interest in a decimated ACC either. That leaves the SEC or the PAC-12. Such a move would also leave the Big XII lifeless.

Oklahoma isn't going anywhere. Except for those kids that are native Sooners, most of Oklahoma's FB players come from within the state of Texas and that is why Oklahoma hitched its Sooner Schooner to Bevo years ago when the Big 12 was formed. This is just an airing of grievances with the hopes that other schools in the conference will pay attention and give Oklahoma some concessions that it wants.

I don't see how Oklahoma needs Texas any more at this point, especially if an invite to the SEC is on the table. While Texas A&M obviously doesn't have the same cache as Texas, the fact that there's already SEC market penetration in the state of Texas makes me think it's not a huge stumbling block.

I think the bigger issue Oklahoma faces in realignment is a similar one to the scenario I outlined with UVA/VT - the political pressure to keep Oklahoma & Oklahoma State in the same conference might sink any potential bid thrown Oklahoma's way.

Once TA&M separated itself from Texas, I had to think that the political ties are going to start breaking in other places as well. Things are changing so rapidly that it's hard to justify holding one school back for the perceived benefit to another.

Suppose Texas left the Big XII. The conference would obviously be in a world of hurt with its future in serious jeopardy. In an "every man for himself" situation, would the politicians really hold OU back? They'd be in just as much trouble with their OU constituents as with those from OSU.

[H.U.S.T.L.E.]

That's a solid point Bill. The only thing I'd argue is that ties between OU & OSU seemingly run much deeper than Texas and Texas A&M ever did. That's an east coast outsider's perspective of course.

Plus, I'd say that in the grand scheme of conference realignment, Texas schools are in a much better position due to demographics. They've got way more people living in their state, so they're automatically more attractive candidates individually. I think that's the reason why OU & OSU are so intertwined when it comes to this whole game - the political movers & shakers that be know that OSU gets left behind if OU bolts, so they'll do whatever is necessary to ensure the long-term health of the two flagship public universities.

[Bill Marsh]

That's a solid point Bill. The only thing I'd argue is that ties between OU & OSU seemingly run much deeper than Texas and Texas A&M ever did. That's an east coast outsider's perspective of course.

Plus, I'd say that in the grand scheme of conference realignment, Texas schools are in a much better position due to demographics. They've got way more people living in their state, so they're automatically more attractive candidates individually. I think that's the reason why OU & OSU are so intertwined when it comes to this whole game - the political movers & shakers that be know that OSU gets left behind if OU bolts, so they'll do whatever is necessary to ensure the long-term health of the two flagship public universities.

You may be right.

I was thinking how strong the ties in Texas were 20 years ago that even a private like Baylor could flex its muscle to insure that it would be included. Or 5 years ago when politicians injected themselves into the PAC-12 situation. But you're right. My perspective is from New England, which is far from Texas.

[_lh]

Regardless of what happens with the ACC, everything in the future of the Big XII hinges on what Texas does. Since Oklahoma is apparently on its way out the door, does Texas really want to hang around with the rest of that group without the Sooners?

Every one of the other 4 P5 conferences has been a rumored landing spot for the Longhorns. So, Ithink we'll just have to wait to see what Texas does. They've been pretty quiet lately. If there's any truth to the B1G - ACC rumor, it suggests that Texas has no interest in the B1G. They likely wouldn't have any interest in a decimated ACC either. That leaves the SEC or the PAC-12. Such a move would also leave the Big XII lifeless.

I agree that the Big XII's fate is tied to Texas but where is Oklahoma out the door to exactly?

No idea.

But the OU pres David Boren has made it clear that he is totally dissatisfied with the way things are being run in the Big XII. That has led to a lot of expansion talk, but OU insiders seem to think that the,even of dissatisfaction is so deep that it is only a matter of time before the Sooners bolt.

Could OU stay? I think that it would take a lot of concessions from Texas and a rethinking of how things are done in the conference as well as expansion with the right candidates. The LHN seems to be a failure so far,so perhaps this could happen.

Knowing how slowly this kind of change happens and how entrenched the self-serving people at Texas are, I'm expecting that the Sooners are as good as gone - especially when I read reports like the rumor in this thread, which suggests some major realignment may come sooner than we expected.

Although there have been rumors of OU to the B1G, I think the more likely landing spot is the SEC with the PAC-12 also a possibility. Pairing them with Kansas could be the outcome unless Texas jumps on board and is willing to make concessions.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/johnklein/john-klein-no-news-is-actually-good-news-for-big/article_4425c70a-7c17-5697-9435-4579f37051fe.html

I think OU wants to stay in the B12 but obviously wants 12 teams. No one can agree on what two to ask and if the two they really want would even accept.