SJU vs. Humboldt St. (Exhibition)

[SJHooper]

@Realfan Never saw a "forum" before where only about 5 people are allowed to post (must all be the same perspective as well) while thousands of others are only allowed to watch on the sidelines. That's why it's not even really a forum, it's just an exclusive group of good old boys who circle jerk and call anyone with a realistic view of the program "neurotic", "sad", or "nuts". Sorry for the fans of other teams who don't know what we are talking about. Redmen.com is a SJ "forum" that alienates fans rather than embraces them. It's very odd. On most forums there are disagreements but the respect is still there. On Redmen, if you disagree with the narrative they want, they let the dogs out on you. If you still give a different opinion after that, you get banned. Not that it really affects me enough but much of what they do is cyber-bullying. They will ban people, then continue to roast them while they cannot even defend themselves. Kind of pathetic, considering most of the members on that site are over 40.

As for the team, they just don't pass the gut check. When I saw teams like Creighton or Nova play last year, they just had a rhythm to them. They always knew what they were doing and their open men almost always hit the shot. They worked as a team and knew their strengths and played to them. You could sense the chemistry. With this SJ team, there is no chemistry. They are a bunch of talented individuals but not a talented team. I saw guys like Pointer and Jordan literally dribbling right into defenders without protecting the ball. Many times the ball was poked out and resulted in a turnover. Guys were missing wide open 3's (Harrison especially). We were out rebounded by Humboldt State, yet the Yesmen.com (thanks Realfan, it's very fitting) crew tell us not to worry about rebounding. I won't count that Obekpa rebound as 2 rebounds. This is a team that looked lost like they were all freshmen. This is a veteran team full of seniors. That's why it was so shocking.

And to the people who say that sometimes DII teams win, who cares? Remember Syracuse vs. Le Moyne? Uh, that's Syracuse…a team that is ranked every year and is one of the best programs in the nation every year. You know a team like Cuse can bounce back. Can St. John's? This isn't our first rodeo either…we almost lost to basically every mid major including NJIT, Columbia, etc. and we beat a DIII team by 2 points last year I believe. It's not a one time thing. It's a major problem. This team cannot separate itself and that's scary. Look at Butler. They are no juggernaut and they beat their exhibition opponent by 40 points. There is something wrong at SJ. Any open-minded, logical person can sense it.

[BigEast1]

SJUHooper, you're not following me. My point was that by your logic the fact that St. John's destroyed Humboldt last year should have been a sign of great things to come. It wasn't. The fact that St. John's beat Humboldt by 12 (or whatever the final was) is not a sign of what the entire season will be. You mention Butler winning by 40, so does that mean they are now in the NCAA? The same Butler team that your St. John's team beat twice last year I might add. Look, I am about the Big East, not St. John's. If you want to give up on your season after one exhibition game be my guest. Since you have all the answers for this year maybe you can start posting on the 2016 season for your team.

[SJHooper]

SJUHooper, you're not following me. My point was that by your logic the fact that St. John's destroyed Humboldt last year should have been a sign of great things to come. It wasn't. The fact that St. John's beat Humboldt by 12 (or whatever the final was) is not a sign of what the entire season will be. You mention Butler winning by 40, so does that mean they are now in the NCAA? The same Butler team that your St. John's team beat twice last year I might add. Look, I am about the Big East, not St. John's. If you want to give up on your season after one exhibition game be my guest. Since you have all the answers for this year maybe you can start posting on the 2016 season for your team.

No, it's not all about the score. The score is a symptom. If you watched our game we played terrible. We won by 12 from mere athleticism. And it took Obekpa having a video-game like day scoring 22 points, 11 blocks, and 10 rebounds which he has never come close to doing. Lots of wide open missed 3's…at least 2 or 3 by Harrison and at least 1 by Amar (the new Italian kid). Not just open…I'm talking by 10 feet. No one around. Could it be nerves? Sure. But last season missing open shots was a problem so this leads me to believe it's more of the same. I'm not saying Butler is a great team to win by 40. I'm saying that winning by 40 is what a last place Big East team should do to a bum DII program. SJ was supposed to be a good Big East team. And the team was down at half, got out-rebounded, and almost lost. That's scary and it's a sign that there is zero chemistry and way too much carelessness with the ball. Obekpa and Harrison are the only ones who looked like they were men amongst boys. Our entire team should have looked that way. We also had lots of trouble with a DIII team last year winning by 2 or 3 I believe. We have tons of trouble with schools like Monmouth, NJIT, Holy Cross, Columbia, etc. It's not just this game. I just don't know how anyone can look at that exhibition and take away many positives outside of Obekpa.

I'm not giving up on the team, I still root hard for them and wish the best. I have just become disillusioned with them. I used to think they were a good team. Now I'm seeing they look like a bunch of moving parts playing individually instead of like a team. The talent is there, the production isn't. We have a shot at the NCAA's still but the Thomas loss might have been the nail in our coffin. It still wasn't even close to a guarantee with him. Without him we are on the ropes. Like I said…30% chance we make it 70% chance we don't unless more players make big strides like Obekpa.

[BigEast1]

Time for Boehiem to retire, Syracuse rallies to beat Carleton by 8 after being down 15.

[muskienick]

I really wonder if the problem is that this is the wrong mix of players which is why we won't make the tourney, or if the problem is that the recruits were overrated and that's why we won't make the tourney. Other than Obekpa and Harrison our recruits have been extremely overrated. Branch was a top 60 PG…he sucks and looks lost all the time. Garrett was a top 100 recruit…he did nothing. Pointer was a top 25 recruit…he cannot handle a basketball or shoot. Jordan was a top 25 recruit…he gave up 8 TO's to a DII squad and looked totally lost. Also at least 3 travels. Amar looks awkward and did absolutely nothing. Won't expect a thing from him. Jones will make a shot every once in a while but he mostly sucks and gets beat 90% of the time. Balamou is good at handling the ball but doesn't do much else.

Is it because the recruits suck?

Is it because of terrible scouting?

Is it because of Lavin?

That's what we need to figure out. It's unreal to me to see this team of top 100 players constantly get burnt by DII and DIII players who score at will and make lots of nice shots. They may not look the part. There may be a lot of doofy looking kids who aren't as athletic as SJ players, but they know how to play basketball and have refined skills. We never seem to find players with real skills. Just a bunch of players who are decent at everything but not great in anything except guys like Harrison and Obekpa.

Holy crap!!! The Johnnies haven't played a regulation game this season yet and you are pissing the season away already! I'm not necessarily a huge Lavin fan by a long shot, but the guy has been in the business for decades. Let him at least fail before you put him in his tomb! Some of you people are even worse than some of the nay-sayers on Musketeer Madness chatboard. They won't be satisfied with Chris Mack until he wins the National Championship and even then, they'll find some way to give all the credit to Sean Miller or Thad Freaking Matta simply for being alive and former contributors to Muskie hoops.

[Amase2]

People need to relax. They did not look good, they shot terrible, they didnt find a rhythm, easy to question Lav. Truth is if we blew them out by 80 people would say not to get excited, only an exhibition. Now its time to run to the woods. St. John's was down by a point with a minute left in their first exhibition last year. Then they beat Humbolt state by 60. Guess what, neither team that played in those two exhibitions was the same team that played when the season mattered.

You think Rysheed Jordan handing out apple turnovers all game is gonna be the same Rysheed Jordan we see all year?

You think christian Jones sucks after not playing a real game for 20 months and coming in and scoring 4 points in his first 2 minutes? Yea he got beat a few times, he just came off of knee surgery. At least he has an excuse.

Jamal Branch sucks? not every one is an all american, he is a good little player.

BTW hooper and realfan, you guys are a match made in heaven.

[Jet915]

Sadly, I probably agree with Hooper. How is SJU any different from last year except they seem to be thinner in the front court......they still can't shoot and they didn't bring anyone in who can shoot. Seems like the same team as last year. A bubble NCAA team.

[GumbyDamnit!]

Sadly, I probably agree with Hooper. How is SJU any different from last year except they seem to be thinner in the front court......they still can't shoot and they didn't bring anyone in who can shoot. Seems like the same team as last year. A bubble NCAA team.

I actually disagree. I think they have the potential to be very good. They may have the best backcourt in the conference. They have the best rim protector on the defensive side in Obekpa. I think some of the other losses from last year might be addition by subtraction. Sampson was the most athletic guy on the court every time he played yet settled for 15 footers all game. Also don't expect Jordan to have games like this.

A few years back Syracue lost its first exhibition game vs. Lemoyne in the Dome. I think they ended up winning the BE that year. As the State Farm Double Check guys likes to say: "Everybody RELAX."

[Jet915]

Who on that team can shoot?

[billyjack]

Another addition by subtraction, though he only played maybe 15 minutes a game, is God's Gift... very good defender, but a terrible shooter, lost on offense, coud barely hit layups, and his free throws were horrible. God's Gift and Obekpa couldn't be on the court at the same time.

And yeah, made no sense at all for Sampson to take all those 18-foot jumpshots. Batts had a great top of key jumper that he'd hit most of the time, with his goal being to burn a sagging defense... Sampson would take dumb baseline 18-footers just for the hell of it.