Big 12 and Big East almost merged

[stever20]

actually about Notre Dame- they would have still been around. They left after Pitt/Syracuse, but before Rutgers/Louisville.

Think you would have seen Notre Dame stick around. That would have changed the equation 1000% for the basketball schools in my opinion. Don't see the C7 leaving in any fashion with ND still around.

Think the big question would have been- Pac 12 up to 16 with Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, and Oklahoma St- who the SEC takes to go from 14 to 16. That to me would have said a ton. If Va Tech goes, all of a sudden things look a lot different.

[Bill Marsh]

that would have been a very interesting basketball conference. The interesting thing would have been would Fox have paid even more to us for that conference. I think it's very possible- just because of Kansas, UConn, and Cincy and even WVU/Baylor back then... Also, I wonder if USF would have tried to block UCF if Memphis may have been a viable replacement. Imagine- Baylor, Cincy, UConn, Iowa St, Kansas, Kansas St, Louisville, Memphis, WVU- plus Butler, Nova, Georgetown. That's almost as good as what we had with the Big East a few years ago.

I do wonder if we added 1 more basketball school- I'm not so certain that it would have been Creighton by any stretch. Butler would have been to me the odds on favorite, remember timing wise, they're coming off the back to back title game appearances. They would have fit perfectly between Cincy and DePaul. Don't think Xavier would have had any shot with Cincy still around, same as Temple with Villanova.

My time line may be off, but i think ND was still around at this point, weren't they?

You are absolutely correct. Notre Dame didn't defect until AFTER Rutgers and Louisville joined the B1G and ACC, respectively. I would then assume you would switch out Creighton for Notre Dame, right? With ND wishing to become a national brand, they would be playing regularly in Texas, Florida and the Northeast in basketball (perhaps even joining the said league with the same 5-game deal they created with the ACC).

The concept falls apart in that, if the PAC-12 went to 16 (with Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State), you would have to imagine the SEC and B1G went to 16 as well to compete. I would guess the SEC would then look at West Virginia and another ACC team (Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina), and the B1G would then look at Kansas, Iowa State, Rutgers, and Maryland to get to 16 (I don't think they'd invite UCONN, who isn't AAU).

No matter how you look at it (Old Big East, Big 12-East, American), the conference would still be ripe for the picking by the higher football conferences. That is NO WAY to be a part of a conference.

1. I don't think that Notre Dame would have gone with that league just to meet certain scheduling goals. Notre Dame has certain other schools that it wants to associate with for a lot of reasons. They found that in the ACC, which is where I think they would inevitably have gone once Syracuse and Pitt left.

2. No way would the Big Ten have added Iowa State. Their expansion has been all about brand name (Nebraska) and markets (Maryland & Rutgers). Iowa State brings neither of those. They showed that they can be flexible with the AAU thing (Notre Dame & Nebraska), so that by itself would not have eliminated UConn. However, I don't think that they would have expanded to 16 just to keep with the Joneses. I think they'd still be at 14 just as they are right now.

3. I think that the ACC is tighter and more stabile than people give them credit for. The real question here is what kind of a TV contract a merged Big East + Big XII remnants could have commanded. If it were enough for Louisville to stay put, then the ACC might have been vulnerable to being poached by the SEC. Once a couple of those dominoes fell, then a couple more might have been available to the Big Ten. That would have been a very dynamic and fluid situation. Even if a couple of schools like Florida State and VA Tech were poached by the SEC, some Big East schools like UConn and one of the Florida schools (UCF or USF) would still have found the ACC footprint and membership more desirable than the sprawling merger conference. With Notre Dame as part of the package, the ACC would have survived, would have been viable, and would have commanded big bucks. Ultimately, even with the lure of the Big Ten, the ACC is where Duke, North Carolina! and Virginia want to be. The Big Ten might have grabbed Georgia Tech, but the ACC could have survived that.

[Boyee]

If Big Ten and SEC would match the Pacific-12 at 16, the Big Ten would try for Missouri and Kansas and since the Pac-12 already would have Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State the SEC could take West Virginia and Baylor from the Big 12 leftovers.

[stever20]

If Big Ten and SEC would match the Pacific-12 at 16, the Big Ten would try for Missouri and Kansas and since the Pac-12 already would have Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State the SEC could take West Virginia and Baylor from the Big 12 leftovers.

I don't think it's a lock at all that the SEC goes that route. I really think Va Tech would have been looked at very seriously by the SEC.

[Bill Marsh]

If Big Ten and SEC would match the Pacific-12 at 16, the Big Ten would try for Missouri and Kansas and since the Pac-12 already would have Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State the SEC could take West Virginia and Baylor from the Big 12 leftovers.

Missouri is already gone to the SEC and they ain't coming back. The Big Ten had their shot at them and they passed.

The big en has made their intention clear that they plan to go for big markets in the East with the only exception being Texas. I think they'd love to get Virginia and North Carolina, but I'm guessing those two will prove harder to budge than they think. The Big Ten is good at waiting people out, so we may not see much movement from them for a long time.

[stever20]

If Big Ten and SEC would match the Pacific-12 at 16, the Big Ten would try for Missouri and Kansas and since the Pac-12 already would have Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State the SEC could take West Virginia and Baylor from the Big 12 leftovers.

Missouri is already gone to the SEC and they ain't coming back. The Big Ten had their shot at them and they passed.

The big en has made their intention clear that they plan to go for big markets in the East with the only exception being Texas. I think they'd love to get Virginia and North Carolina, but I'm guessing those two will prove harder to budge than they think. The Big Ten is good at waiting people out, so we may not see much movement from them for a long time.

I'd also say that if Texas/Oklahoma go Pac 12, the teams the SEC would go after would be Virginia Tech and NC State. I think Virginia Tech is THE team that the SEC is wanting more than anything quite frankly..

[GoldenWarrior11]

Another school I feel bad for (in addition to UCONN and Cincinnati) during the whole realignment shuffle is West Virginia. They got a big payday from the Big 12, but they are forced to be making huge trips to Texas and Oklahoma on an annual basis. Since joining the conference, Bob Huggins has gone 30-35 (15-21 in conference). They were always in the top half of the Old Big East.

I'm curious why the ACC (or SEC, for that matter) never made a run at them. They are currently (and will be for a long time it seems) standing alone on an island in the Big 12. It makes too much sense for them to add a Cincinnati (or Memphis) just to give them a travel partner.

[micgoG'town]

Hoya boards were intrigued (and desperate) by this rumor when it got started. Most felt it wouldn't last long, that the only stability would come from an all basketball conference. Everyone thought that would be at least 5 years away. The fact it happened in a year or so is amazing. I couldn't be happier with how it worked out.

[SJHooper]

Not gunna lie...that would have been a scary good conference. Getting to play UConn, L'Ville, Kansas, Cincy, etc. each season would give us so many chances for huge wins to put us in the national conversation. I think it would have been great but my gut says that St. John's would never finish better than say 3-5th even in the best year. I just don't think teams like SJ, PC, Butler, Seton Hall, etc. would be able to seriously challenge them on a consistent basis. Kansas would win like 20/22 matchups against those teams, and same for L'Ville. I remember being in the old Big East...I'd get excited that we really had a shot playing Cuse and L'Ville but the truth is that they are just too strong most of the time. We would beat the Cincy's and UConn's then get throttled by Cuse and L'Ville. Kansas, Cuse, L'Ville, etc. are on an entire different level.

I think this is the best scenario for right now. But with that said, we have a LOT of work to do. We need to get teams in the top 25. We can't afford for G'Town, Marquette, and SJ to be bad teams. G'Town needs to go back to being a perennial top 25 team, Marquette needs to get back to at least being in the conversation for #25-30 or so, SJ needs to start making tourneys, PC needs to pickup where they left off, and Creighton needs to prove they are more than just McDermott.